its a story we’ve all heard before:
boy approaches girl at lupe fiasco lookalike contest afterparty. girl is charmed by boys proper use of “peripheral” when describing her booty, and gives phone number to boy. boy calls girl three and a half days later, and continues to charm girl with the type of detached emo-negro affected behavior that sistas with glasses, asses, advanced degrees, and daddy issues love more than crackheads love stilts.
girl and boy plan date. girl is so enamored with boy that she requests boy as a friend on facebook. boy happily accepts, but is troubled when an email titled “yo…” ends up in his facebook inbox a day later. apparently, boy’s buddy recognizes girl as “easy e” –a name girl (ericka) was given while she was a sigma sweetheart in college– and warns boy that girl has been around the block more times than a mailman with alzheimer’s. boy investigates buddy’s claim, and finds that it is true. girl has actually slept with somewhere between 4 (confirmed) and 124 (rumored) guys.
upset by the fact that girl “hid” this info from him, and relieved that he found out before he actually kissed her, boy cancels date with girl, citing “shingles” as the reason for the change of plans. disappointed girl curses to herself, and begins to write and market memoirs about her experiences as a successful and single black woman.
the idea that a woman’s number –how many sexual partners shes had– greatly effects how society and (most) men will regard her has been practically embedded in our brains since birth. little girls are taught how to properly sit down “like a lady” by their grandmothers two minutes after they first learn how to stand so that they won’t appear to be “fast”, and little boys are taught to avoid fast girls while we’re still so young that we’re still grossed out by what fast even means. this stigmatization intensifies as we age, as even an unsubstantiated rumor about a young woman’s excessive sexual activity is enough alter everything from her social status to her career arc.
nowhere is this idea more evident than in the dating and relationship game, where men are not only given carte blanche to insult, degrade, and dismiss promiscuous women…we’re actually dissed if we don’t. the only thing worse than a ho is a captain hell-bent on saving them.
there are myriad evolutionary and physiological reasons used to explain why this mindset has been ingrained in us, but these three are cited a bit more often than others
1. because there’s more of a likelihood that sex will do harm to a woman’s body (ie: pregnancy, an increased vulnerability to STD’s, etc) than a man’s, women who sleep around and continually put themselves in harms way have their decision-making abilities and sanity questioned, damning traits for anyone hoping to be a mother.
2. only in the past half-century or so has a man been able to verify without a doubt that his kids were undeniably his. because of this, its easy to understand why we hold relatively chaste chicks in higher regard than wanton women. its kind of hard to take someones word that “it’s yours” if you know they’ve already slept with the entire 2010 AFC pro bowl roster
3. men are natural explorers and discoverers, and no man wants to claim some scorched earth thats already been explored and discovered by the next n*ggas tribe.
thing is, none of these oft-cited reasons directly address the most important element in all of this, the real logic behind the continued animus towards wanton women, the driving force behind the boy from the story canceling the date plans: our dicks.
you see, for a woman to truly understand how neurotic men can be about our own sexual prowess/performance, take your hang-ups about your body, your weight, and your hair, combine them, and multiply them by ten.
why is this important?
well, if a woman’s been “around”, its assumed that she’s been exposed to an array of different people, penises, and sexual practices and positions. in the (typical) man’s mind, this exaggerated sexual experience means that there’s an increased chance that he’ll be unable to please her, and, subsequently, unable to keep her faithful. this is the main reason why most savvy men learn to adapt a “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy if they’re really into someone, but would have had serious trouble even getting to the “really into her” point if he was made privy to her past. even if this thought-process is completely off-base and untrue, we tie so much of our self-worth into our ability to satisfy the woman we care about that even the assumption that a woman might be sexually unpleasable automatically makes her unwifeable.
who knows, maybe one day things will be different, and women will possess the same relatively unstigmatized freedom to act on their sexual whims that we currently do.
until then, my advice for all the “easy e/erickas” of the world? build a time machine. if that doesnt work, just date reggie bush
—the champ
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{ 346 comments… read them below or add one }
Thanks for explaining why its important… because I never understood that aspect of it… although its still dumb and men need to get a grip… if women can’t hold you to the same standards of promiscuity then they shouldn’t turn their nose up at a chick that’s been around the way. I want a dude that has been selective with whom they’ve decided to go there with just as I have been not someone that has boned 50plus different chicks just because he could. A real man doesn’t think the amount of women he’s been with makes him a man. Quality not quantity.
@Eb the Celeb,
“because I never understood that aspect of it… although its still dumb and men need to get a grip”
Spoken like a true woman (No offense). The Champ just gave you the game on a silver platter, and yet you rebuke ye. Tsk Tsk. Men are quite simple. If a promiscuous woman meets a man that she likes and vice versa, when the conversation about “numbers” arises, just lie. Once the seeds of decite have been sewn, stick with it for a few years, until you all are “going steady – a la Zack Morris and Kelly Whatshername. Then, once the feeling strikes you to expose your former whore-ish ways, deliver the “death blow.” At this point dude is way to deep in the game to leave now and you would have had lifted that six hundred pound barbell of of your chest. Your welcome.
@themagicman,
If a promiscuous woman meets a man that she likes and vice versa, when the conversation about “numbers” arises, just lie. Once the seeds of decite have been sewn, stick with it for a few years, until you all are “going steady – a la Zack Morris and Kelly Whatshername. Then, once the feeling strikes you to expose your former whore-ish ways, deliver the “death blow.” At this point dude is way to deep in the game to leave now and you would have had lifted that six hundred pound barbell of of your chest. Your welcome.
damn, lol
@The Champ, “damn, lol”
For real! LoL
@themagicman, That’s not what I meant by my comment. When I said thanks for explaining it was explaining the fact that men have a problem with it because of insecurity issues. The men thinking they’ll be unable to please a chick if she’s been around the way is the part I was speaking of and never knew before.
Fact of the matter is … what men don’t know wont hurt them… if you are truly in love with a chick and then you find out after you are already in love that back in the day more than you would like # of dudes hit that… you are not going to leave her… and if you do you are a fool because true love shouldn’t be negated because of someone’s past.
@themagicman,
This is BlkBond, I am a general with the ‘Mack Pack’. I want to inform you that you are in violation of penal code #2587-divulging too much game.
Bond.
@Eb the Celeb,
A real man doesn’t think the amount of women he’s been with makes him a man. Quality not quantity
while this is true, lemme ask you a question: could you be in a relationship with a man if you heard/knew he’d had homosexual sex in the past?
@The Champ, lemme answer that…no.
@The Champ, what does a man having sex with another man have to do with this??? I don’t get it… but to answer it no I wouldn’t because in my head that means part of you will always have the desire for a man and at any moment would leave me for one. As many situations have happened in the past with women trying to forget and marrying a man and getting divorced later because he didn’t want what they had.
@Eb the Celeb,
what does a man having sex with another man have to do with this??? I don’t get it… but to answer it no I wouldn’t because in my head that means part of you will always have the desire for a man and at any moment would leave me for one
lol. my point is that the way you (and most women) feel about a man who might have been with another guy in the past is basically the same way (most) guys feel about wanton women.
@Eb the Celeb,
“if women can’t hold you to the same standards of promiscuity”
It’s not a challenge for most women to get sex, so it’s more like a lack of self-control. Plus women have like a thousand double-standards that work in their favor. It’s funny to see them get worked-up about the small handful that don’t.
@Alos, in the past I would have agreed with you… but in this day in age with the amount of diseases that are going around… men should be just as selective with whom they choose to sleep with as women… its time to grow and evolve and realize the state of HIV/AIDS in the African American community and stop saying oh its okay for me to be a hoe because I’m a man and its always been that way. That’s dumb and many of penises have suffered because of that mentality.
@Eb the Celeb,
I don’t think that Alos is making a value judgment, so much as pointing out that the reason for the “double standard” is that (as Scipio points out below) it’s much easier for the average woman to get random sex when she wants it than it is for the average man, so high numbers don’t have the same meaning.
@Helagramki,
“it’s much easier for the average woman to get random sex when she wants it than it is for the average man, so high numbers don’t have the same meaning.”
the realest thing ever wrote. in fact, there is no combating that comment.
champ raises a very good point. i am too confident to worry about what the last or next man is doing in the bed room so that does not play into my stance on this. my ego is HUGE but it is not fragile like that.
women want a man who makes them feel safe…. conditioning and evolution have shaped what that man looks like (tall, athletic, etc.) some of the weakest men I have met fit this profile but you could not tell a woman that and guess what? we men have to suck it up….and it is what is is.
on the flip….most men want to settle down with a woman who they feel is not the bucket for these taller more athletic men….i have approached some of my former buckets out at the club and i know the dudes they were with could smell i had my way with them….. because i did not hide the fact. not many men can handle that and frankly, if you are “my lady” i should not have to. maybe a bit unfare but hey, a lot of things between the sexes is not fair.
and whether the ladies think it is fair or not….it is what it is and it will not change. act accordingly.
@Dave,
I will say that one great irony is the extent to which men are expected to suck it up when it comes to their woes, but people people rebel against the idea that some parts of the game that turn out to be negatives for women will continue to be part of the game for some time.
hmmmm…i was expecting more….*kanyeshrug* and so you really mean the number counts cause yall think the more men we may have had the more you may not be able to satisfy us…i call BS….u didnt even cite fear of loss of elasticity #imjussayn
@Caramel eclair,
See, I chose to embrace the overall sentiment that it matters cuz they foolish.
@Caramel eclair,
hmmmm…i was expecting more….*kanyeshrug* and so you really mean the number counts cause yall think the more men we may have had the more you may not be able to satisfy us…i call BS….u didnt even cite fear of loss of elasticity #imjussayn
lol, this is actually the same concept. there’s a reason why most people would rather cop a couch from ikea instead of craigslist
@Caramel eclair,
Elasticity lost from activity is regained from abstinence. Elasticity lost from pregnancy is more pronounced and will usually remain lost…unless she’s not too lazy and uncaring to do kegel exercises. #imjussayn.
hmmm…interesting. while i agree with the final statement of this post, i would like to point out that men place their bodies at the same level of risk with regards to promiscuity and stds. (#1) why? because a number of stds are asymptomatic in men until it’s kind of too late. for example chlamydia. yes, it can cause sterility in women and lead to pelvic inflammatory disease if left untreated for too long, but many men don’t even know they have it so they pass it around until they have severe symptoms. another one i’d like to mention are yeast infections. not an std, but again if you have unprotected s*x, men can contract yeast infections, pass them on to their lover who goes to the store and gets monistat and then give it right back to them to the woman.
bottom line- i don’t think i really want equality in this department, (as far as h*-ism is concerned) at the same time i don’t care for the stigma that is placed on a woman who is moderately “active”. plus being a lady means you don’t kiss and tell (well except for on this website, we’re a dysfunctional family of tell-alls).
@Miss Patterson,
“bottomline-I don’t think I really want equality in this department…”
I wish more women felt this way, for real. Whether we call it double standards or whatever, we are held to DIFFERENT standards. Why does some women want the right to be a hoe?
If a woman has a man who handles all the financial resonsibilities to the extent where she doesn’t have to lift a finger if she doesn’t want to, she’s considered “well taken care of”. If a man does the same and a woman does everything for him, he’s just a “lazy a*s n*gga”. It’s like a man going around and talking about, “I want a woman who’s going to protect and provide for me.” Women (and men) will look at him like he’s just sorry. Some things just aren’t meant to necessarily be equal.
@Monk,
Church and Tabernacle; however, I have come to the conclusion that many people who disagree are either: naive, young, or Non-Black Americans in this aspect of the Black relationship debate.
Bond.
@Miss Patterson,
“another one i’d like to mention are yeast infections. not an std, but again if you have unprotected s*x, men can contract yeast infections, pass them on to their lover who goes to the store and gets monistat and then give it right back to them to the woman.”
***filed under “comments you probably shouldn’t read while you’re eating cream of wheat and a bagel”***
@The Champ, you nasty. i will never ever eat cream of wheat or farina again. thank you.
@Miss Patterson,
cream deez
@The Champ, ewww!!!
bastards.
contradictory, cruel-when-referencing-the-very-women- they-tell-more-chaste-chicks-they- should-feel-liberated-enough-to- experiemnt-on-par-with; clever enough to amplify women’s insecurities enough to distract from their own; and probably in need of a church-hug, yet angling for the non-church like rub. but bastards, nonetheless.
the same dude that tries to convince you he won’t judge you for doing the dirty on date 1 is the very one who shudders to think bout what some other neanderthal may have previously done to her. I don’t know whay y’all even torture yourselves. Probably be somewhere calculating, she musta done that at least 3.2 times before cuz Daaammmnnn! (Five seconds later…) I’ma kill that nucca she practiced on $#%!
p.s. champ, your honesty here astounds me. i’ll be very pleased if most of the guys resist the urge to refute your musings.
@bittersweet’s baby, unfortunately men are quite simple……Champ has exposed it….and no man will/should deny it……Interestingly, we don’t have to……No matter how many people (my sisters, actual sisters, not other black women) you put on game, women (all of ‘em) will continue to be slaves to their emotions and fantasy worlds that they create and reinforce for each other…..thus, women will take the same course of action irrespective of their knowledge of the rules of the game
@Blacklaw,
Well said.
@Blacklaw,
PREACH
@Blacklaw, In a nutshell (no pun intended.)
@Blacklaw,
This is BlkBond, I am a general with an elite unit from the Mack Pack. I am citing you today for violation of penal code #2587-too much game. I repeat, you are giving up TOO.MUCH. GAME. You silence is immediately required. (laughs)
Great post my dude..
Bond.
@Blacklaw, wut the heyll are you talking about?
@Blacklaw,
Actually, alllll of ‘em minus at least one. It’s easily recognizable to me cuz I’m a realist. Plus,there is much value in having an older brother who won’t sugar coat things. He also shared classics as “Why a regular dude and an eager but toothless crackhead can go into an alley and both come out smiling 5 minutes later” and “P***y ain’t got no face…”
@Blacklaw,
get that book deal brother.
damn the brothers are on fire today! i love it!
I think this problem stems from old fashion notions there’s still the assumption that women all want steady relationships. If she’s sleeping around that much it’s to lure a man into a real romance. Also there’s a girls who sleep around aren’t good people fallacy. Lastly, there’s still this stigma about women enjoying sex-good girl or whore. It’s just extreme.
@Manny,
Also there’s a girls who sleep around aren’t good people fallacy.
yeah, i alluded to that in the entry. while it may not be true, people (men and women) do have a tendency to make judgements on a womans total being based on how much she sleeps around
Aw naw! Not the shingles!
Are ppl still getting that even? He might as well have said ‘yellow fever’, although swine flu would’ve been much more believeable.
So… what number to men is reasonable? Because I get a screw face for my *whispers* lack of numbers and the homegirls get stoned for… let’s say…. 7? Yeah, 7 soooo, what # do men NOT mind?
@Made In Hawaii,
“What number to men is reasonable?”
One.
J/K. I can’t really say how many, but age is definitely a factor. If you’re on your second hand and still in teen years, not cool.
@Made In Hawaii, All men are NOT created equal. It varies. Every man is going to say low but everyone is going to define low differently/ Its like asking what p3nis is best for women? All of you are going to say big, but big to you might not be big to her.
@Made In Hawaii,
So… what number to men is reasonable?
there is no concrete “reasonable” number, just peace of mind
@Made In Hawaii, The funny thing about actual numbers is if you say a girl averages 3 guys every 2 years, and assuming she started having sects at 16, then by the time she’s 30 years old, her number will be 21. 3 guys every 2 years doesn’t sound like much, but 21 guys overall sounds like alot. It’s a paradox.
@Made In Hawaii,
a man’s number depends on the type of man he is. If he’s a square and always has been, it will be very low. If he was a live/wild dude himself, it will likely be high in comparison to average.
I don’t think it is the ‘number’ that bothers men, rather then context. For example, if a woman has 7, but 4 were boyfriends, 2 were exclusive courtships, and 1 was a gimme ( one night stand, groupie moment, etc.), she would still be looked upon favorably.
However, (keeping with the number 7), if she had 3 one night stands, a train (2 guys), a group moment (she loves trey songz), and 1 boyfriend…she’s not getting chosen for a relationship. Do you see why? He judgment is irresponsible, inconsistent, and destructive. Men begin to asks themselves if they can trust her with the check book? Will she remember to pick up the kids on time? Will she be able to keep her legs closed? Even if the answer is a slight yes, most men will bet NO.
Like women, men are mindful of their hearts; moreover, their time and money. The difference is that many men protect themselves by not even entertaining the possibility, i.e. cut our losses early.
Bond.
@BlkBond,
I think that this is it. From most of the other commentary here (e.g., saltiness about the female who smashed the homies), context probably matters more than numbers.
I personally think the whole “numbers” concept is BS. Firstly because men and lauded and idolized for their sexual prowess and conquests while women are degraded for it (and called names such as “young smuttery” “cum receptacle” and “The Situation’s sister”). Yes I know its one of those societal things that will never change yadda yadda… If a woman has unprotected (and sometimes protected) sex with ANYONE – whether its the first of 50th, she could possibly get pregnant or get an STD. I know someone (not ME lol) who got the herp from the second guy she slept with and she was far from a whore or promiscuous.
The questions people should really ask potential sex parters:
- Have you ever done intravenous drugs and shared a needle?
- Have you ever had a blood transfusion?
- Have you ever slept with Shaq/Tiger Woods/etc?
Just my two cents before I hit the sack.. see you all in the AM
@BKSweetheart, basically, the same questions asked when you give blood.
@BKSweetheart,
“Firstly because men and lauded and idolized for their sexual prowess and conquests while women are degraded for it (and called names such as “young smuttery” “cum receptacle” and “The Situation’s sister”). Yes I know its one of those societal things that will never change yadda yadda”
If more women approached men I think the double standard will start to change. If men always approach you and you never turn any of them down why would a man think different? Some women lose credit by not having discretion.
@Humble_One aka The Market, I think its really an male ego/machismo thing.. I mean no guy wants to “wife up” some chick that a bunch of other dudes have already smashed..
C’mon guys – how many times have you clowned some dude because he was going out with your old jumpoff chick?? That’s like a guys worst fear.. that he’ll be called a “simp” or “captain super save-a-ho” Or that after he’s been treating a chick like a princess spoiling her and buying her sh*t only to find out some lesser dude was just coming through and smashing without doing any of that…
@BKSweetheart,
C’mon guys – how many times have you clowned some dude because he was going out with your old jumpoff chick?? That’s like a guys worst fear.. that he’ll be called a “simp” or “captain super save-a-ho” Or that after he’s been treating a chick like a princess spoiling her and buying her sh*t only to find out some lesser dude was just coming through and smashing without doing any of that…
if this is true, than how is “the whole “numbers” concept BS”? i mean, your comment above suggests that you understand how a guy might feel a certain way
@The Champ, nah I’m just sayin i can understand a guys perspective but it has nothing to do with whether a woman is “virtuous” or STD-free… its more of an ego/teritorial thing i’m basically agreeing with your stance “men are natural explorers and discoverers, and no man wants to claim some scorched earth thats already been explored and discovered by the next n*ggas tribe”
I’m just saying its a BS cultural standard… why are women called whores yet men are called playboys.. why is it so culturally unacceptable for a woman to take charge of her sexuality and actually enjoys sex and does it because she wants to – not because someone “gamed” or “G’d” her into it…
@BKSH, the double standard exists because men and women have two separate general realities regarding our abilities to pull the opposite sex for some sex.
That’s not a justification, but this *is* the cause of the double standard. Unless a woman is hideous, she probably can think of at least 5 guys off the top of her head who would have sex with her before the sun sets today, if she asked them the right way. The average non-hideous guy can think of maybe 2 or 3 girls he might have a chance to have sex with by the end of the month if he took her out a few times, laid impeccable game, and mastered his Dummies Guide to Hypnosis book his line brother bought him for his birthday.
Point being, attaining sex is a sign of mastery, skill, persuasion, and overcoming of obstacles for men. For women, sex is a sign of granting permission, acceptance of a request, and generally does not indicate any sort of feat. The real equivalency between men and women would be a man getting sex, but a woman getting a long-term commitment or marriage proposal.
But if you *really* want to get into double standards, the flipside of this double standard is the one that calls a guy corny if his numbers are low, but calls a woman virtuous if her numbers are low (although there can be some problems for the woman on this end, too, but that’s a side point.)
@Scorpio Africanus,
That is some of the realist ish I ever saw written. Kudos.
Y’all on fire today. Ladies, your printers should be goin’ OFF!!
Bond.
Hmm I see. But what I really don’t understand is who are these guys “practicing” with then? It’s such a paradox…dudes trying to keep their numbers (& experience) up and a girl’s numbers low. & most guys aim to get some whenever they can. & when they do get it, I’m sure they appreciate some experience and prowess in the sac.
It’s not logical.
@Root, it’s supposed to just be a few women that everyone sleeps with to get practice. like a sex shaman or something.
@Dee,
lol, basically.
on the flipside, many women say that they wouldn’t want to be in a relationship with a man who’s less sexually experienced than she is, so the mysterious sex shaman circle continues and sh*t
@Dee,
haha a sex shaman huh? What’s unfortunate is the concept of concurrency in hiv and other sti transmissions. This sex shaman concept is more dangerous than having partner a for x amount of time then moving on to partner b, then c etc. Especially keeping in mind that most sti/stds stats are much higher in the black community.
I’d want to stay away from a dude who’s had a session with a sex shaman…
@Root,
They practice with Easy e!
Sounds alot like something I wrote two months ago, called 6 Reasons Not to Date the Around the Way Girl (Praying Mantis).
I knew I wasnt the only one that felt this way, Champ
@The Hallway/TheSunk,
“I knew I wasnt the only one that felt this way, Champ”
this is exactly what stacey dash told me the first time i met her
interesting, post….
people come with a past.
if a man finds a woman attractive. It would be logical to assume that other men have noticed her as well; however, I understand how a woman’s “number” can play on a man’s mind.
@Tooshy1,
welcome and sh*t
“you see, for a woman to truly understand how neurotic men can be about our own sexual prowess/performance, take your hang-ups about your body, your weight, and your hair, combine them, and multiply them by ten.”…@Champ……this to me was the MOST powerful line in the post, your honesty humbles me & makes me thinketh perhaps you should be teaching some “Men should be honest with women class and sh*t”…leaves room in awe of the Champ……once again.2010 is your year!
@bajanflchick,
thanks and sh*t. my honestly humbles me as well. i’m a humble-ass motherf*cker. its not a game with my humbleness game
I think that your conclusion is true, but that
(1) insecurity about one’s own numbers may occasionally play a role, and
(2) as noted above, to the extent that numbers are assocated with looseness, the perecption that one is “saving” the woman is also a source of discomfort.
As an example of both of these, I remember this segment on Dave Chappelle where he plays this woman’s boyfriend. She’s asked what’s the craziest thing she’s ever done and answers that once, while in college, she was in a threesome with two guys. Chappelle storms off upset, and she goes running after him.
@Helagramki, LOL “We’re f*ckin DONE!!”
@BigBuck,
…Hitting old “gang bang” here with out a rubber…
That was such a classic skit. His face, his reaction, all so authentic. Your man never wants to hear all the secrets, even when he asks. He will remember them forever. I had that disease as a youngin’ and there is nothing worse than asking questions whose answers change the way you look at your chick forever. Sometimes you can overcome it, other times, not.
@Helagramki,
1) insecurity about one’s own numbers may occasionally play a role
this is true, but, as i mentioned upthread, i think it goes both ways. just how men typically wouldnt choose to be with someone more experienced than he is, many (if not most) women claim that they wouldnt want to be with a guy if her experience dwarfed his
@The Champ,
I guess my point was more that to the extent that male numbers symbolize prowess, a man being outdone in the numbers department might be insecure about this disparity in itself, rather than because he fears that he might not be able to satisfy the woman, much like a man might be insecure about a woman who makes 2-3 times his salary, or is better than he at contact sports.
Unfortunately numbers count esp. when relates to women. Just the way it is…Though I wonder, hypothetically, if most guys have boned 50 women and most women are ‘supposed’ to have boned, say, 4 guys, isnt the ratio extremely screwed? I say this based on the tendency for most women to keep their numbers low and most men high. Then either a) Most men are liars b) Most women are liars or c) There’s a small pool of extremely salacious lascivious promiscuous women out there! Its philosophical…
@Mr Dingo, Man, all three are true….
@Plain Ole Peyso,
So, so true!
@Mr Dingo, Man,
welcome and sh*t. and yea, like peyso said, all three are true, lol
I heard a comedian say once that a woman’s “number” should not be greater than her age. Simple math d*cks over birthdays. For some guys even that is not acceptable. Some want to believe they have found the only 32 year old virgin in America, nevermind the 6 year old kid. Insanity.
I am a firm believer in not asking questions you may not like the answer to. If you are happy with this person why would you ask a question that may tear all that apart. We men love to act like we don’t have a past. Hell most of us really can’t give you an accurate number.
The truth is it’s not really about how many guys a woman may have slept with. A man’s ego doesn’t like to hear about ONE man you slept with. We have an overwhelming desire to at least believe that we are the best thing to ever happen to your sex life. So the thought that there is someone else who maybe used to be better than us can mess with our heads if allowed.
Personally, as long as there is no disease or anything, I don’t care about a number. It just can’t be ZERO! I don’t enjoy interacting with a virgin. At my age I think its just weird.
I would even venture to say I might consider dating an ex porno chick. Emphasis on ex. If you really think about it, those women have probably slept with less men than your average college student. They screwing the same 6 or 7 guys in every flick. But because we see them in action we assume they are the nastiest skanks ever. Does the presence of a camera really make her any nastier than any other woman? She just can’t stay in the business if she wants to be with me.
@BigBuck,
I so agree with you!
Even though my number is not high and I could give you first, middle, and last names of every man I’ve slept with if a gun was put to my head, I am a firm believer in not asking questions that you do not really want the answer to!
What I have found however, is that men will say they don’t want to know your number, but then ask you roundabout questions like “Girl, where’d you learn that from”, when you put it on them in the bedroom! My answer is always “A book; you should research every skill that you intend to master”. This goes over much better than ” Well, my ex use to like it when I did him like that”.
@More is More,
welcome and sh*t (i think)
@BigBuck,
I agree with this comment. Ionno bout that pron chick, though. It’s one thing to have your boys fantasize about your girl. It’s a whole nother thing to be able to pull out a dusty dvd and watch her.
@Lil’T,
lol, yeah. i think ole buck might be alone with that one. as many kids i’ve wasted watching caramel or lucy pearl, i’d probably have to be hypnotized or something before i considered getting in an actual relationship with one of them
@BigBuck,
The truth is it’s not really about how many guys a woman may have slept with. A man’s ego doesn’t like to hear about ONE man you slept with. We have an overwhelming desire to at least believe that we are the best thing to ever happen to your sex life. So the thought that there is someone else who maybe used to be better than us can mess with our heads if allowed.
***nodding head***
@BigBuck,
“The truth is it’s not really about how many guys a woman may have slept with. A man’s ego doesn’t like to hear about ONE man you slept with. We have an overwhelming desire to at least believe that we are the best thing to ever happen to your sex life. So the thought that there is someone else who maybe used to be better than us can mess with our heads if allowed.”
Makes sense. So, you’re saying the possibility of this (possibility of someone being better than you) is increased as the number increases, right?
@Cheekie, in so many words, yes…
Sexually speaking, the burden of performance is generally on men…we’re evaluated by women in many ways, but chief among them is the perception of our sexual prowess (i.e., does he look like he workin’ with sumthin, can he hit certain spots, etc.). How we perform between the sheets is important, and (being the competitive creatures we are) sexual prowess is like the ultimate expression of male competition and dominance. Hence, the higher her number is, the more experience she has to base an evaluation on…
I’m with Buck tho…I don’t ask questions that I don’t want to know the answer to…
@DG,
Word.
Where’s the picture?
@JumpOnIt,
picture deez
@The Champ, that was actually a good one, Champ. congrats.
@JumpOnIt,
lol
Hmmm, I’ve read some very unconvincing arguments about why the “number” is so important. But this rightchere? This was some welcome honesty from an actual man. Kudos Champ. Y’all kickin azz and takin’ names in ’10, huh?
I also think that this situation is a little different because the guy had a reliable source. Would he have asked if he never got that email warning?
I can’t support asking for no dayum reason. And really can’t even remember the last time a man asked. Cuz seriously bruh – most of us ladies who are near or over 30 have a decade+ of history to account for. And I can’t tell you what I had for lunch 2 days ago, lol. You better be happy with my clean bill of health and lack of baby daddy drama.
@Lil’T,
I also think that this situation is a little different because the guy had a reliable source. Would he have asked if he never got that email warning?
thats the thing. he probably wouldn’t have cared or inquired if his boy didnt let him know first.
basically, we’re all a bunch of mario winans ass n*ggas, lol
@Lil’T,
I have to co/sign this entire message. And yeah, I haven’t had men asking about it either… And like I have said here before, when faced with a pesky questionner just answer: “You are the only who matters Hon”… End of discussion.
@Lil’T,
“You better be happy with my clean bill of health and lack of baby daddy drama”
amen!
I always took the “how many” question as a way for a woman to see where you might stand on her “LIST”. No woman wants a guy that has seen more cooch than her GYN. At the same time, I don’t imagine they’d want a newb or someone they’d have to coach in the sack, either. Someone mentioned elasticity. I’ll buy that. “Falling in” is never fun! LOL
It all seems a bit insecure if you ask me. I’ve learned to either not to answer the question, or give some BS like, “more than 1 and less than Wilt Chamberlian.”
@Joppie,
“Falling in” is never fun!”
definitely a t-shirt
First of all…
Lupe Fiasco lookalike contest? Um…no
Fragile egos are the reason ya’ll shouldn’t ask anything about a number. You weren’t the first to conquer the mountain, and that bothers you.
I learned my lesson early. I won’t ask a dude, and I’m certainly not telling. Not that my number is like redic or anything, it’s just not that important. Ask all the other important questions like, “do you believe in giving a girl proper tongue action?”, and “do you have any crazy fetishes I should know about?”.
*when I was 22 I did ask a dude about his number. It was in the triple digits and he was like a year older than I was. Needless to say, I was mad skeeved out, and that was the end of our courtship…lol
@miss t-lee,
*when I was 22 I did ask a dude about his number. It was in the triple digits and he was like a year older than I was. Needless to say, I was mad skeeved out, and that was the end of our courtship…lol
he was lying.
@The Champ,
LMAO.
You think? I never even thought of that. I was already disgusted, dah well.
@miss t-lee,
You think?
definitely. not saying that its impossible, but most 23 year old men don’t even know 100+ different women, so imagine the probability of a guy knowing and speaking to 100 different women that they actually want to sleep with, and being able to actually sleep with each of them.
again, though, i’m not saying its impossible, lol, just that i seriously doubt someone whenever they’ve said they’re in the triple digits.
@The Champ,
LOL!
IDK he was an athlete (football player, Div1 school) so hey…I figured it could have happened.
If he was lying that was a major fail on his part…ya know? I’ve heard of kats lying to get the goods, but lying when it kills your chances of getting the goods? That’s unheard of. LOL
IDK he was an athlete (football player,
“Div1 school) so hey…I figured it could have happened.”
ok. this changes things because a) he’s traveled and been able to meet more women, and b) he’s reached a status where women (ie: groupies) try to sleep with him to upgrade their own status.
i still think he was lying though, lol
@The Champ,
*giggling*
The world may never know.
@miss t-lee,
“First of all…
Lupe Fiasco lookalike contest? Um…no”
That made me snicker….literally
Maybe a Common look-a-like contest…not no Lupe Fiasco
@lovin’ me,
That Lupe line messed me up. I started giggling for almost a minute after that.
I could get with the Common lookalike, maybe around the “Be” album era, not the crochet pants though!
@miss t-lee,
Yeah, Lupe and look-a-like stopped me dead in my tracks for a second. lol
And yes the crochet pants are a no-go. I seen him in concert just after Be w/ Finding Forever (twice in one year. fanning self. woo…) Yes that was a wonderful time period.
The only thing I got mad about a couple years later was he didn’t have his American Gangster muscles at the time. lol…but it really didn’t matter, he was still fine.
@lovin’ me,
*daps*
i always go for the by three rule..
a continually boastful man’s conquests can safely be divided by 3
and for a seemingly too demure woman multiply by 3…
don’t know why.. but it works…
@london,
don’t know why.. but it works…
lol, how are you sure it works? i mean, do you do background studies to verify truths or something?
and warns boy that girl has been around the block more times than a mailman with alzheimer’s.
That is just wrong… lol!!!
@N.I.A. lovesthekids,
and extremely inefficient.
@The Champ,
Folks on the other block will never get their mail.
Ok, lemme stop…this whole thread is just wrong. lol
That’s not my reason at all.
@Legendary Dash,
What is it?
@Cheekie,
In my experience women who were ran through when they were younger are not very good at sex anyway, unless they were tossed by vets of course. More than likely they have been messing around with clueless young cats and have had poor sexual skills become habits. All those “positions” don’t mean jack if they are still not climaxing.
well, if a woman’s been “around”, its assumed that she’s been exposed to an array of different people, penises, and sexual practices and positions. in the (typical) man’s mind, this exaggerated sexual experience means that he’d be unable to please her, and, subsequently, unable to keep her faithful. even if this thought-process is completely off-base and untrue, we tie so much of our self-worth into our ability to satisfy the woman we care about that even the assumption that a woman might be sexually unpleasable automatically makes her unwifeable.
This was never an issue for me. I never worried about what the dude before me did. It’s not true that a woman that has been with a lot of dudes is actually good or had good sex. I have dealt with a handful of women that have got it in with a lot of dudes. I was always surprised when they talked about something that I did or how they enjoyed it and I’m thinking to myself how I didn’t do anything.
@Humble_One aka The Market,
“It’s not true that a woman that has been with a lot of dudes is actually good or had good sex.”
i know, but that doesn’t change the fact that perception and feeling does more to craft these opinions than actual facts ever will
I haven’t asked about “numbers” in more than a decade…it’s really not important. Especially considering the fact that 96.3% of women lie about their numbers any way. Then again, they don’t think it’s lying, they just don’t “count” certain transgressions. I’ve heard it before…he only lasted a minute, he doesn’t count…I was drunk, he doesn’t count…he was little, it doesn’t count, etc..
Some men still lie to boost (or decrease – yes, this happens) their numbers also.
Men lie, women lie…
@Monk,
I haven’t asked about “numbers” in more than a decade…it’s really not important.
me neither. in fact, i dont think i ever have. thing is, while ignorance is bliss, sh*t like myspace and facebook have made it nearly impossible for that type of bliss to continue
@The Champ,
There is a rule about having your exes on youf FB page… I forgot it, but it’s out there.
@The Champ,
“sh*t like myspace and facebook have made it nearly impossible for that type of bliss to continue”
LOL, true. Like, hasn’t that been like one of those secret status updates by now?
I forgot to add this
I’m not concerned about my pride as far as not being good enough. I’m more concern about my pride in the following situation. This is a true story that happened 2 months ago.
There was a group of talking ish playing dominoes and the name Suzy came up. Now out of the roughly 7-8 dudes that was there 3-4 had been with Suzy. Actually those 3-4 were just a fraction of who she has been with that we know. Those 3-4 didn’t include her current boyfriend who was there too. So the dudes get to talking about what she did and how it was. They are trading war stories of being with her. So her current boyfriend had no idea that she got down like that. Dudes face just dropped and cracked when he heard all of this. He got up and left the room seriously f***ed up.
I’m only concerned of who you been with before me only if you have a track record of being with losers. Even with this I to give women leeway because most have a phase of giving it up to losers. I think most men aren’t worried who smutted their girl before him. They are more worried about being this cat.
@Humble_One aka The Market,
I don’t think it’s an issue, per say, if she has a track record of sleeping with losers, I think it’s an issue if she has a track record of sleeping with men who run in the same circle.
A woman could have a large number, yet have these men spaced out all across the USA; in that instance, the above scenario would have never taken place.
@Humble_One aka The Market,
Ole girl broke about 15 rules in the Playette’s handbook on that one. Never – NEVER sleep with that many guys in the same circle. If 2 or more men can sit around and have a conversation about your skills you’ve effed up. Seriously. Take a vacation and stop making the block hot. Now I can’t hang with you in public lest I be associated with your, ahem, indiscretions.
@Lil’T,
*snickering*
Really!! She needs to do some dirt outside of her zipcode…lol
@Lil’T,
Yeah, she needs the Playette Handbook 2.0 (e-book format) and a kindler sent to her with the quickness.
Suzy did herself a huge disservice. Not only did she date losers, she dated losers who run in the same circles. Tsk tsk tsk.
@Sula,
I wonder if we can use this as evidence of true ho-ism. In my book, a ho is a woman who does not discriminate with her chexual partners. It’s really not even tied into numbers. If Sally has chex with 15 guys (from different states/areas) and Suzy has chex with 5 – but all 5 were on the same football team and 2 of ‘em are brothers – who’s the ho? My call is still for Suzy. Sally is more scandelous but she was discriminate enough to keep her business to herself.
@Lil’T,
You know I am with you. I will call Suzy the prime Ho, because for me Ho-ism comes from the intent behind the act. Apparently, Sally just likes good chex so she discreetly enjoys it at her convenience… On the other hand, it seems like Suzy is after something else
possibly self-esteem… and that something else has little chance to be found. Whereas Sally will be able to settle with a guy who gives her the goodamn…. Dear Suzy might still be trying to find that lost something years after her prime.Yup, Suzy is definitely the Ho.
@Lil’T,
Naw suzy and sally both hoes. One just doing off the plane, while the other doing off the bus.
@Humble_One aka The Market,
I’m only concerned of who you been with before me only if you have a track record of being with losers
so it would be ok with you if you found out that the chick you’re currently seeing let like 35 rhodes scholars run a train on her?
@The Champ, so it would be ok with you if you found out that the chick you’re currently seeing let like 35 rhodes scholars run a train on her?
LMAO!
@The Champ,
LMAO. NO!
I’ve never worried about the “number” since I’ve been attracted to older women since I was a teenager. What worries me is if she is especially orally talented. I’m talkin eyes-roll-in-the-back-of-your-head, unable-to-speak catatonic good. You don’t get that talent w/o lots of practice. Moderately skilled is fine but a oralsmith (just made it up) is an intellectual challenge. No one wants someone who no skill but you don’t want someone who minored (and took extra credit courses at the local community college) in it either.
As men we would like to think we can help you get better.
@Stank-0,
“You don’t get that talent w/o lots of practice.”
You’re right. But she could’ve gotten all that practice with one dude.
@miss t-lee,
Badda bing. lol
@Stank-0,
Moderately skilled is fine but a oralsmith (just made it up) is an intellectual challenge
LOL
@Stank-0,
Oralsmith…stolen for future use.
@Stank-0,
You don’t get that talent w/o lots of practice.
Practice can be done on one man…. for like 7 years of dating or something.
@Stank-0, “You don’t get that talent w/o lots of practice. Moderately skilled is fine but a oralsmith (just made it up) is an intellectual challenge. ”
I had a girl tell me “they” called her Einstein after just returning from a long deployment. This post reminded me of her.
This subject has been debated on blog after blog. I think, there are more things a man should be concerning himself with other than my number of sexual partners….knowing that should have no bearing on our relationshiq…I don’t want nor need to know your numbers….and it shows some insecurity on the man’s part if he needs to know mine’s….get a grip, it is not that serious.
@QueenT,
“knowing that should have no bearing on our relationship”
hmmm. so you’re saying that a guys sexual past has no bearing on how you feel about him, as long as he has a clean bill of health and has been faithful to you?
@The Champ, Right!
@QueenT,
Your comment makes me think of what one of guys said upthread… something about women ignoring the rules of the game or something…
I’ve found that the men who ask me this question are the ones who are the worst in bed. I’m sure there’s a mathematical equation to support this but I majored in english.
@RocktheCatbox,
lol, don’t let the english degree stop you from crafting bullsh*t equations. i do it all of the time
welcome and sh*t, btw
@The Champ,
Thanks and shit.
@RocktheCatbox,
Worst in bed and most insecure.
@RocktheCatbox,
You know what? You might be onto something here… LoL!
A womans needs can never be substainably met by a mans benevolence. There will be more gaps created in her fullfillment to needs ratio than 100,000,000. x she’s gapped her legs in an attempt to charge for it. Remember this on Feb. 14th if you find yourself paying out of obligation and maybe even resentment, that only a woman could truly appreciate. Thousands of cards & flowers will find their way to the garbage can in the ensuing weeks along with millions of calories around their triceps, jawls & a**es. But I’ve digressed. This post was about a womans number and how men assign value based on it & ultimately about men and their insecurity about not being able to sexually satisfy a woman who’s been around the block eleventeen jillion times and the double standard in how they’re viewed. Don’t worry Easy E, Ho Ho Ho’s get married errrrday, male and female. Just get in your car and go to the next city or state. Some of us are, will or have been married to them and don’t know. And don’t forget marriage and relationship is no cure for insecurity. Our sense of worth and that we place on others almost depends entirely on the opinions around us. Often, it is a need to receive the public approval associated with marriage, or to fulfill a childhood fairy-tale fantasy that we have had pushed down our throats.
@Triple Crown,
damn. someone took their smart pills and sh*t this morning
@Triple Crown,
post of the decade – oh right VSB hasn’t been around that long okay the year thus far!
No such thing as gender equality but there should be human equality.
@Triple Crown, LOVE IT!!!! I co-sign your first message also. I am single on V-day and you helped me to get over it:)
I have always been mindful of the game and how it is not fair. I have accepted this truth and I am at peace because of it. Here is my issue though, although men say the numbers game is important women like me sit at home single because we choose to live a life that is called from a higher power. I am not sexually active and I continue to see women get attention who clearly does whatever to whomever. So I have to wait until a man gets tired of running around after hoes and start a family. The game is not fair!
Very interesting premise, Champ. And I can see how some men may rebuke an actual or perceived promiscuous woman because they believe they won’t be able to please her sexually or their sexual ability won’t top one of her other lovers. However, I think it’s much more simple than that… most men don’t want to date a woman who just gives it away. Ultimately, men want at least the appearance of a lady in the street, and a freak in the sheets, whether she’s been an actual pure lady or not. Just like some men have standards regarding the HS dropout, they have standards regarding the Loosey Goosey.
IDK, I’m not a man, but it just seems that some men just don’t want to be “that man” with “that woman.” But, I agree with your post overall. Thanks for the insight.
@N.I.A. lovesthekids,
Just like some men have standards regarding the HS dropout, they have standards regarding the Loosey Goosey.
the hs dropout bit confused me. can you expound and sh*t?
@The Champ,
basically, i meant some men have standards regarding the type of women they choose to date. A lawyer may not date the HS dropout b/c he has standards regarding the education of the women he dates. I think numbers are the same way for some guys. He has standards, and a woman who’s been around the block may not fit the bill…. at least not for dating/wifing/marrying.
Also, I think it’s about believing your lady is a prize, a treasure, and presenting her to the world as such. That can be hard to do if the world already know her….
@N.I.A. lovesthekids,
Also, I think it’s about believing your lady is a prize, a treasure, and presenting her to the world as such. That can be hard to do if the world already know her….
co-sign.
I really don’t think a lot of women expect or want equality (because we don’t think men are capable of it, so we’re over it). None of us expect men to be ok with women having a lot of sex partners. We just want you to understand that we care very little about your opinion in the matter. I can’t speak for all women but most of us want men–especially strangers, people we just met or are getting to know–to please spare us the entitlement bullsh*t because it’s transparent and weak. It makes us not want you. It makes you instantly unattractive, even with your master’s degree, 80s man looks and upscale magazine subscription. The real problem I think is that men believe women are going to like them forever (the man shortage myth) no matter what they say at our expense. Be plesant to look at, shut the hell up, enjoy the p*ssy you are getting and we can be cool. But I guess the point of the article is that most men can’t do this…LOL.
F*ck.
@RocktheCatbox,
We just want you to understand that we care very little about your opinion in the matter.
eh. i’d beg to differ. whether its right that a woman’s sexuality is a big issue is one thing, but i do think that most women care about how they’re perceived in regards to sex. i mean, even the most lascivious women usually try to somehow conceal or downgrade their “business”
@The Champ,
Really, no, lol. It might be how “me and my friends” roll (I hate to even say that) but I spend a lot of time with women who truly don’t, and not in that fake way some women brag that not caring will make them appear cool to dudes. Possibly because we’re in our dirty 30s where not giving a hell is the norm, possibly because I’ve dated plenty of men who actually like women, as people, but there is a difference between hiding your sexual past because you’re worried about what others think of you, and simply choosing not to share the details of your sexual past. Just because a woman doesn’t share the details with anyone who will listen doesn’t mean she fears judgment. I don’t share because I have no interest in that kind of icebreaker activity, period. Why? It just seems like a stupid thing to do, like any other stupid thing. I’ve had a few men “confront” me about who I’ve been with and I’ve said, yeah, I hit that, what’s your point? I could care less if they dumped me over it, but none ever have. I know, again, it’s not the standard for women you know, but it is for the women I know, lol.
@RocktheCatbox,
there is a difference between hiding your sexual past because you’re worried about what others think of you, and simply choosing not to share the details of your sexual past. Just because a woman doesn’t share the details with anyone who will listen doesn’t mean she fears judgment.
I have to entirely agree with this and the message above.
Might be the dirty 30′s showing. He he he.
@Sula,
I’m feeling the dirty 30′s as well.
@RocktheCatbox, AMEN SISTER
I’m not in the dirty 30′s yet though… if I’m still single I might be a problem lol.
@BKSweetheart,
the fun begins when you realize you’ve started to say exactly what you think to your friends, family and coworkers. Story: Visited my parents house. My mom kept bugging me about not being home one night and where I was, etc. and I just shrugged and said, well the sex was good, I wasn’t about to come home early. Went upstairs to bed. Look on her face: priceless. This is what the 30s will do to a bitch.
@RocktheCatbox, that’s f*king comedy (no pun)…*shrugs* they need to learn “we grown now”- lol
@RocktheCatbox, LMAO!!! That sounds exactly like something i would say…
matter of fact, i co-sign basically all your comments today…. could you be… my e-doppelganger????? Lol
@RocktheCatbox,
At 40, this question will be entirely irrevelant. Don’t ask, don’t tell is pretty much the norm. My number is in the high 2 digits but I’ve been single for forever. The thing is I know plenty of married woemn in my category whose husbands have NO idea. At this point, my past is not your business. And vice versa.
We’re thinking too much. I think its rather simple. More women date male ho3s b/c a woman will get applauded for “changing him” from his ways while a man will get clowned for trying to change a heo to a housewife
@Plain Ole Peyso,
Yes, great advice for people who don’t have hobbies, see previous post about grown assness. Once you are past this phase in life where the people you date are your pet projects, that kind of ish is irrelevant.
@RocktheCatbox,
I don’t see this as “advice,” just as an observation about how society differently perceives of men and women who end up in relationships with partners known to have a prolific sensual history.
@Helagramki,
I believe you. ..but I think advice and observations are a pair of freaky bedfellows up in this forum
@RocktheCatbox,
Fair enough!
I want to re-ask the question of what the appropriate number range is.
Having only been with one man myself (my ex-hubs at that) I can certainly tell you that not only do men not believe me, it’s not welcomed. (or maybe it’s the current celibacy that they don’t like, anywho) Plus I dont think my ex was too thrilled w/being the first.
@OftenConfused,
“Plus I dont think my ex was too thrilled w/being the first.”
If you don’t mind me asking (if it’s too personal, I completely understand), why not?
@Cheekie, nah it’s cool. I think his issue was he just couldn’t believe a person could only be with one person, that surely you’d be curious and just have to try with someone else. Somehow I think he thought if I had some experience that my curiousity could be satisfied and I could be pleased with him or maybe he just wanted to think he was outdoing someone. IDK
Plus he was just insecure and jealous always thought I was cheating…hence the divorce.
@OftenConfused,
Oh, I see. So, his main issue was not just being your first, but being your first AND being your husband (which made him think you’d have a problem with having only one partner for — presumably — the rest of your life)?
@Cheekie, I believe you’re right. It wasn’t so much “first” as it was “only”
@OftenConfused,
Gotcha.
Oh this is my first post and sh*t!
Love the blog, very informative and entertaining.
@OftenConfused,
welcome and sh*t.
and, again, its not so much about the actual number as it is peace of mind.
@The Champ, But that’s part of the question (I think). What number is the number past giving peace of mind? I know it varies for the particular man, but this is where the issue falls. Like is anywhere between 4 and 12 acceptable, 13-18 borderline, and anything over is just now you’ve f*cked with my peace of mind?
Listen here. Many men are un-good in bed. That ranges from terrible to “meh.” that includes some of you on this site. I’m not ball- bustin I’m just laying out probability and relevance. You should be thankful for a woman who has had experience because she can at least tell you how to please her or do it herself during coitus and fake like it was u making her scream. The bottom line is I think we put up with ur egos alot. I’m going to go the femenist route and say this: it’s my body and I shouldnt have to think about your ego when dealing with my vagina.
If I was safe, got tested,was pretty reasonable ie., no sex tapes of trains being run have surfaced; know how to use a semicolon and have shown what a kind hearted person I am – it shouldn’t matter how I expressed my sexuality in the past. Studies show women have just as much sexual urge as men…what u need to worry about is the woman who is so repressed that she would never do Something special or adventurous in bed to gently and subtley correct your “Meh” performance.
@Sigh,
Agreed. My point is, if he gets to share his unsolicited opinions, I get to express to him that I feel his opinion is worth dick.
@Sigh,
“The bottom line is I think we put up with ur egos alot.”
lol, and we don’t?
welcome and sh*t, btw
@Sigh,
Well stated.
@Sigh, Very well stated.
@Sigh,
cosigning you completely…
For those who listen to Foxxhole Radio, Claudia Jordan once brought up an interesting theory on her show:
Say a woman starts being “active” at the age of 18. Let’s say from 20 to age 30, she may have 2 serious relationships that last 1 year each. For the sake of conversation, let’s say she averages 2 partners per year (I’m low-ballin’ here *insert pun). By the time she’s 30, that’s at least 20 wangs on her resume. That’s not taking into account the flings, one night stands, dudes who don’t count, Spring Breaks, that one weekend she was in Cabo, etc.
So yeah, us men have huge egos that love to please and satisfy our women, but I wouldn’t say that’s THE main reason we get turned off by a woman’s high numbers. It’s b/c we either think you’re a h*e, or you come bearing “gifts.” And if we think/know you’re a h*e, we still might smash… we’re just not taking you out in public!
@SouthernCharm,
Say a woman starts being “active” at the age of 18. Let’s say from 20 to age 30, she may have 2 serious relationships that last 1 year each. For the sake of conversation, let’s say she averages 2 partners per year (I’m low-ballin’ here *insert pun). By the time she’s 30, that’s at least 20 wangs on her resume. That’s not taking into account the flings, one night stands, dudes who don’t count, Spring Breaks, that one weekend she was in Cabo, etc.
thing is, her calculations are off because she doesnt account for repeats. i mean, its not like women (and people in general) usually just sleep with two people in 2006, and never, ever sleep with them again. as we get older, we’re more prone to hit up “ol reliable” in times of drought than somebody new
@The Champ,
LOL!!! You don’t recount a repeat. It’s still the same person. If ya’ll have been together twice or 20 separate occasions, it’s one.
*I understand this is probably chick logic.
@miss t-lee,
That’s not chick logic, that’s basic statistics. Don’t count the same thing twice.
*passes a list to Miss T-Lee*
Haven’t seen you in a while. Here’s my throat-punch list. I’ll have payment ready by Friday.
@Lil’T,
LOL!! I’ll make that happen for you. It’s been too long since I’ve served up a throat punch.
@miss t-lee, i agree you don’t count repeats. that’s like counting each time you had s3x with your boyfriend as a different person just because he was in a different mood each time. i realize that statement made no sense but whatever…
@Miss Patterson,
LOL! I completely understood this.
@miss t-lee,
I don’t think that he saying that you should count repeats, but that Claudia Jordan’s reasoning is flawed because some of the random relations (after the club, dry spells, etc.) will be with FWBs and old jump-offs or exes rather than with a new guy every time, so her number, for the average woman, might be high.
@Helagramki,
*confused face* I’m kinda lost,so are you saying that you shouldn’t count random relations? I know some folks don’t count those, but in the grand scheme of things, it does count.
@Helagramki,
“I don’t think that he saying that you should count repeats, but that Claudia Jordan’s reasoning is flawed because some of the random relations (after the club, dry spells, etc.) will be with FWBs and old jump-offs or exes rather than with a new guy every time, so her number, for the average woman, might be high.”
(charlie murphy voice) wrong… wrong! the random relations can include the numbers that women don’t count or the random relations they take to the grave with them. lol.
assuming a 30 year old woman has been chexually active for 12 yrs, with a couple of long-term relationships here and there… and she meets & dates/talks to/is the jumpoff of at least 2 new guys per year… then the number can easily be 20+ by the time she’s 30. that’s not including the random relations that COULD happen in between then (one night stands, vacation flings, male friend she “mistakenly” slept with, etc.).
@miss t-lee and SouthernCharm,
First post:
Say a woman starts being “active” at the age of 18. Let’s say from 20 to age 30, she may have 2 serious relationships that last 1 year each. For the sake of conversation, let’s say she averages 2 partners per year (I’m low-ballin’ here *insert pun). By the time she’s 30, that’s at least 20 wangs on her resume. That’s not taking into account the flings, one night stands, dudes who don’t count, Spring Breaks, that one weekend she was in Cabo, etc.
Champ:
its not like women (and people in general) usually just sleep with two people in 2006, and never, ever sleep with them again. as we get older, we’re more prone to hit up “ol reliable” in times of drought than somebody new
*******
I took Champ as saying that the 20 that Ms. Jordan came up with might be inflated (for the average woman, not the superwomen who frequent VSB), because she might be double counting dudes. So guy X might be one of woman Y’s two in 2006 (when she’s 20 and a sophomore, and he’s 23 and on the 5-year plan at a 4-year school or in grad school), and one of her two again in 2010 (when she’s moved to DC, where he, as she later finds out through a mutual friend, is working), and then one of her randoms for 2011 and 2012 before she gets into a serious relationship in 2013. Not factoring in repetitions of roles, and promotions and demotions, could inflate the number of individual men involved (whether one wants to count randoms and flings or not).
I wasn’t trying to contradict either of you, just to clarify (if I understood him correctly; I may not have, and I’m sure that he’ll speak for himself if he hasn’t as I’m typing this) that Champ was saying that Jordan probably wasn’t correctly counting repeats, not that repeats should be double counted.
@Helagramki,
I understand now. Thanks for clarifying your stance.
@Helagramki,
“I took Champ as saying that the 20 that Ms. Jordan came up with might be inflated (for the average woman, not the superwomen who frequent VSB), because she might be double counting dudes. So guy X might be one of woman Y’s two in 2006 (when she’s 20 and a sophomore, and he’s 23 and on the 5-year plan at a 4-year school or in grad school), and one of her two again in 2010 (when she’s moved to DC, where he, as she later finds out through a mutual friend, is working), and then one of her randoms for 2011 and 2012 before she gets into a serious relationship in 2013. Not factoring in repetitions of roles, and promotions and demotions, could inflate the number of individual men involved (whether one wants to count randoms and flings or not).
I wasn’t trying to contradict either of you, just to clarify (if I understood him correctly; I may not have, and I’m sure that he’ll speak for himself if he hasn’t as I’m typing this) that Champ was saying that Jordan probably wasn’t correctly counting repeats, not that repeats should be double counted.”
I gotcha. Yeah, repeats don’t count. Just b/c she’s on/off with a dude for 3 years doesn’t mean that 6 other guys haven’t been in the picture during that time.
@Helagramki, SouthernCharm, miss-t-lee
yeah, helagramki is right. i was trying to make the point that claudia jordans method of adding partners is flawed (and skews high) because most women aren’t picking up two new sexual partners every year for 10 consecutive years.
its not that i think she’s not counting repeats in her total. she’s just not accounting for the fact that women (and men as well) are more likely to do multiple repeats than someone new, a fact making her “20″ high.
what grown mofo actually asks this question tho??? LLS
@OrangeStar616,
lol, nice reference to last week’s post about grown males. I figured it was mostly a “don’t ask, don’t tell” thing too. I mean, it’s for your own good in a lot of cases. If you ain’t ready for the worst possible answer (or what YOU think is the worst possible answer…because to her, it ain’t no big thang), then don’t ask the question.
@OrangeStar616,
Ha! Exactly… after you’ve told me how old you are, I’ve already got a number in my head.
@SouthernCharm, watch those ASSumptions dear..like most mofos would think I was probably very active based on looks/age etc but thats SO not the case LOL..anywho like I said what secure mofos actually ask that numbers questions?1?
Sexual health, kids, views on monogomy, true sexual orientation etc these are the things that actually NEED to be asked/discussed
@OrangeStar616,
I feel you on assumptions. I’m not going off of looks/age… just age. Just being realistic. If I meet a nice, 25 yr old chick… then I’m already assuming she’s had maybe 10 partners. If she’s had less than that, then cool.
@SouthernCharm, gotcha
@OrangeStar616,
Bingo!
@OrangeStar616,
what grown mofo actually asks this question tho??? LLS
lol, no one, really. but, like in the story, even if you dont ask, sh*t has a way of being found out
@The Champ, didn’t know it was a secret or even something done in the dark coming to light…….. see there is a diff between things that NEED to be known and things that really don’t, things that really have no use cept to disturb mofos peace of mind..IDK *kanye shrug*
@The Champ, exceptions, like if you were a roller, and had been ran thru by pratically your entire area code. I’m not talking about that kind LLs
@OrangeStar616,
right….!!!!!
lmfao @ a “lupe fiasco lookalike contest afterparty”.
So, tell me, men. Is it the extremes that bother you? Do you want all girls to just fall in the middle of the range? That’s the perfect, wifeable woman? If the number is “zero” it’s a problem, and if it’s more than [insert relative number here], it’s a problem. But, as the resident VSB unicorn, I have to ask which one bothers you more, a girl whose number is too low (there’s only one number as far as I’m concerned…lol) or a girl whose number is too high? Like, if it was a “have to choose your own adventure” type situation, what would you honestly pick, and why?
@Cheekie,
Personally, I wouldn’t look at the number only. I’m looking at your number AND your age. It’s perfectly normal IMO for a 30 year old woman to have 20+ partners. I would expect a 20 year old with 20 partners to come with a Pimp Named Slickback.
@SouthernCharm, You rang! Yeah, all of the girls with a number in excess of 20 before they are age 20 have worked for or are currently working for me. No big thang. I thought this was common knowledge.
@Slickback,
lmfao @ “Slickback” appearing.
@Slickback, “You rang!”- lol… you stoopid
@Slickback, ROTFLMAO @ you magically appearing upon your name being mentioned! Friggin’ priceless!
@Cheekie,
“So, tell me, men. Is it the extremes that bother you? Do you want all girls to just fall in the middle of the range? ”
I think it is the extremes that bother most dudes. At certain point you know the majority of people have had sex. Its one thing to have normal relations it’s another thing to have never turned down a d**k that was offered. The issue that most women don’t get is that men have to work to get sex. Women don’t. If a guy talks to 10 women and gets 2-3 out of 10 he is doing fairly good. A woman can easily get 9 or 10 out of 10 guys. So if it is that easy men expect you to use some descretion.
@Humble_One aka The Market,
“The issue that most women don’t get is that men have to work to get sex.”
So, if she did have to work to get it, the extremely high number would be okay?
@Cheekie,
I yes and no. Yes because being she had to put in work but no because she can get pregnant and is more susceptible to STDs. The double standard is there because of those 2 no’s.
@Cheekie,
The number alone doesn’t bother me as much as the idea of possible STD reception and the # of children already present.
are there people that live life worrying about this? like, actually modifying/obsessing over their behavior out of fear of not getting “wifed” or being “chosen” to be seen with someone in public? It’s starting to sound like 1852 up in here.
@RocktheCatbox,
You bring up an interesting point from the women’s side. Really, how much do we worry about what men think of our history knowing that the only reason they care is insecurity? I would say generally, not at all. But I’ve also seen the fallout when a woman does not manage her desires and it ain’t pretty – especially when the sh*t hits the fan in front of the one guy whose opinion she does care about.
@Lil’T,
I don’t think it is all insecurity. How would you feel if the man you were dealing with had been around. When you two step out the house there is always some woman that knows him.
@Humble_One aka The Market,
How would you feel if the man you were dealing with had been around. When you two step out the house there is always some woman that knows him.
He has been around. Emphasis on “has been”. Past tense. If I trust him (read if his behavior within the relationship has showed me that he can be trusted), the entire Dallas CowBoys squad can know him for all I care… Like I said, it depends mostly on how he behaves in the relationship.
The last of my concerns in a relationship is how many chicks know my dude. Who motha-effin’ cares?
@Sula,
IDK. Maybe it’s just my experience. It seems that all the women that I have known and dealt with that gave it to anyone always had some underlying emotional issues. On top of that I seen too many women with repeated scared pregnancies and people catching ish to be that liberal in this. I’ve been at parties where I’ve seen people having unprotected sex with dancers. I might feel like you if I didn’t experience these things.
@Sula,
I agree, and actually this is for Humble. I think dating is a choice, and you don’t have date the woman with emotional issues, when there are plenty of women without them. Choosing to date someone who has obvious deep emotional issues (pardon me in advance for my presumtion)…sounds like a Captain in the making. Damn, bro. ALL the women in your life? You need a hug and a plane ticket.
@Lil’T,
I think you are right too. I think distinctions should be made for those who are hoping x amount of blowjobs, x amount of candlelight dinners, x amount of warm feelings add up to a relationship that leads to marriage (I kid, I simplify), and those who are dating for sport. When you approach dating and sex like a way to self-entertain–I agree, tho, that managing one’s desires is something any adult ought to be able to do, purely out of self-preservation–some things become non-issues. Obviously this kind of behavior in women is baffling to men, and I know men who approach life like this and women find them unbelievably attractive. We all know this guy, lol. I had one dude say to a girlfriend of mine that he was going to pursue her until he made her love him as much as she loves herself (he eventually gave up after several years. she was relieved). So I guess what I’m saying is…a more complex look at people’s MOs are in order.
@RocktheCatbox,
“sounds like a Captain in the making. Damn, bro. ALL the women in your life? You need a hug and a plane ticket.”
I didn’t say all the women I have dealt with. Just the ones that I knew that slept around a lot.
@Humble_One aka The Market,
Noted. I rescind my comment.
But there still might be a little Captain in ya…
I ask for three reasons…to gauge her level of prudishness, to determine my level of engagement, and to drive her away if she is a prude. I have a tendency to meet those who are uncomfortable even discussing anything related to seks. They act as if seks is something dirty or nasty, and is only a tool for procreation…not recreation. That’s a real turn-off. Chances are, if she’s had 10 plus partners she’s not a prude.
I also want to gauge my initial level of effort required. If she’s had numerous partners, I’ve gotta bring my “A” game on day one. If she’s inexperienced, I can bring forth an introductory, mediocre, yet satisfactory effort that not only will leave her wanting more, but will leave me with more to bring. Theoretically, I can introduce her to more and more as time and interactions progress. With someone inexperienced, if I go all out on the first occasion, it’s more likely to scare her away.
Unlike many, I’m not “put off” if her number is high. It simply tells me that she’s open-minded, is more likely to be able to please me, she enjoys seks, and I will probably be able to spend more time enjoying instead of instructing. It’s also less likely that she’ll be making me wait for something we both want.
Whether she’s experienced or not, protection and testing are vital – it’s also a part of the openness and trust required to sustain a relationship. Sure it takes away from the romance or potential pleasure, but given the possible down side, I can wait for going raw.
Communication is vital in any relationship. I don’t feel that there should be anything we couldn’t talk about to each other. We will either accept each other for who and how we are…or we won’t. Moreso, I don’t like surprises. If she “knows” the high school football team, then I “know” we won’t be going to the class reunion.
Some will be tempted to start labeling, i.e. “ho, slut, slore, etc…”, but hoes need love too! Maybe she had to kiss a few frogs before finding her prince.
@Caballeroso,
Unlike many, I’m not “put off” if her number is high. It simply tells me that she’s open-minded, is more likely to be able to please me, she enjoys seks, and I will probably be able to spend more time enjoying instead of instructing. It’s also less likely that she’ll be making me wait for something we both want.
i know i can’t speak for whats going on inside your head, but i find it hard to believe that it makes absolutely no difference to you if a woman you’re initerested in was “out there’ or not.
yup, i’m officially calling bs.
@The Champ,
yup, i’m officially calling bs.
And therein lies the crux. Most people tend to believe the rest of the world works like them. That is such a fallacy, it’s almost comical.
What makes you (or the majority of men or which ever proportion we come up with) tick, will not necessarily make every single other male out there tick. Maybe because I have most of the time been in the minority on things (as opposed to what “most” do) I have always been acutely aware of the “other side”… Being in the majority might have its advantages, but it also ends up making folks feel a false sense of uniformity.
@The Champ,
I had a former S.O. tell me her number was 50. I’ll admit that the number was greater than what I expected to hear and did get my attention; however, the seks was great and I rolled with it. The fact that she was an alcoholic is what ended that.
@Caballeroso, “The fact that she was an alcoholic is what ended that.” o_O bwahahaha… I don’t know why that was so funny to me.
Anyway, your post… hmmm… spoken like a true slut/pimp- have we met before?
@Caballeroso, Not all women with a low number are prudes. Most of them is because of their moral standards – once they get a man they are commited to they will try all sorts of things.
Back in the day (think back to the Agrarian period etc) one had to learn the moves through ‘practise’ with many partners. Now, we in the Information age – theres self help videos, pornos and sh*t that can teach the moves. Youd be surprised by how many ‘prudish’ women are aware of what needs to be done.
@Mr Dingo, Man, Thank you!
Hey, was that last statement about dating Reggie Bush because he’s dating Kim Kardashian and everyone knows that she’s been about the block several times?
@Just X,
nah. it had more to do with him being from san diego than anything else
@Just X,
Not that I’m some KK-Save’em, but I still don’t get why people label her a “garden tool”. She was married and then dated a couple of “high profile” dudes and happen to make a secks tape with one. I know madd chicks that have done way more than this and dudes consider them “wife material”…they just didn’t have the noteriety, fame and video camera to put them on blast.
What gives?
@AkShone,
That’s a good question. For all we know, she has only dated Ray J and Reggie Bush. If that tells us anything, it tells has that she has a knack for cute (term used loosely) black guys with (allegedly) big wangs. And that’s about it.
But I guess, we all need someone to blame for all things weird… Jim Jones can’t take it all.
@AkShone,
I think it has to do with her association with Paris Hilton. That whole crew of Hollywood socialites (Lindsay Lohan, the Hilton sisters, etc.) has managed to gain a “reputation” for being somewhat loose-in-the-crotch. So while we may not have a concrete idea of Kim’s actual number, the circles she ran in have come to make her a hoe-by-association. Unfair, but true…
“the only thing worse than a ho is a captain hell-bent on saving them.”
Tell da truff and shame the devil!
@Kamala Jones,
the devil (and king kong) aint got sh*t on me
Good ish man. Can’t argue with your logic.
I will add, that men understand that if society teaches women to avoid being hoes then a woman who still manages to become an uber hoe is obviously unstable and not worthy of a time investment.
I mean, isomebody is training you from birth, then that training is being augmented by societal pressure, yet you still can’t get it right?
Clearly you are an irredeemable eff up and should be avoided like Lady Gaga’s snatch. There can be no other response.
@Big Man,
I mean, isomebody is training you from birth, then that training is being augmented by societal pressure, yet you still can’t get it right?
what if (playing the devil’s advocate) the “training” is wrong, and they’re actually doing the right thing by bucking the system?
@The Champ,
Depends on if you think the system is wrong.
Most cats don’t.
Clearly my response was tongue-in-cheek in keeping with the tone of the website, but I do believe that most men find it strange that a woman would go against so many norms to engage in a behavior that appears, on the surface, to have such limited advantages.
Yes, a variety in sexual experience is nice, but if the VSS of this blog are to be believed, the vast majority of men are poor sexual partners. So, for every guy slanging that good yike, there are like five with no skills. So a chick sleeping with a lot of dudes is playing sexual roulette, and the in playing the game she’s creating more difficulties in her professional and personal life.
Seems kind of @ssbackwards, no?
@Big Man,
While that is certainly one way of looking at it, there’s also the possibility that she is a free thinker who’s actions are not dictated by a society of sexually repressed peers who pressure her to conform to their narrow-minded ways of thinking, whereas she chooses to be true to her own internal and instinctive drive…other’s opinions be damned. Just a thought.
@Caballeroso,
Or, she could be a hedonistic, pleasure seeker uninterested in the larger consequeces of indiscriminate sexual intercourse and the impact it might have on on her physical, emotional and spiritual self. She may think she’s freeing herself by being with as many partners as she desires, but she is actually enslaving herself to a new master, lust.
I mean, if we’re going to trade speculative comments assign postive attributes to those we agree with and negative attributes to those we disagree with, I can play that game.
But, I’d rather not. Instead, my first comment stands as it was written. I think that most men believe that it shows a lack of self-control and possibly stupidity if a women is overly promiscuious. We look askance at someone who bucks so many norms to engage in a behavior that appears to have far more cons than pros. Or, the men I’ve met seem to think that way.
@Big Man,
Or, the men I’ve met seem to think that way.
Now, that’s a sentence I can get behind. Unfortunately (or fortunately), our world is a very, very big place.
@Big Man,
Not trying to enter a pissing contest, just recognizing the other side of the coin from a non-judgemental perspective. Hedonists are cool with me, and just because you’re a hedonist doesn’t mean you’re indiscriminate, or careless. Some choose to enslave themselves to lust, some enslave themselves to God and godliness. Either way is fine as long as it’s Your choice.
@Caballeroso,
I respect everybody’s choice.
Just disagree with labeling one choice as non-judgemental and the other as judgemental.
I’ve found that most people judge other people for their choices. Whether they be into free love or monogamy.
Oh, and it just so happens I wrote about Double Standards regarding women and sex on my own blog today. Crazy, right?
Um … do men actually believe that their dicks keep women faithful? Really?
@Michele, Hello!!! Thank you for asking this!!!!
Men’s erroneous belief that their little mandingo has anything to do with a woman remaining faithful may be the crux of a myriad of relationship issues.
@Michele,
No we don’t. I had to tell my boy this one day. I’m telling him that this chic he is messing around with is getting it in with other dudes when he isn’t there. He didn’t believe it. This chic knows my boy has a girl and he is messing with other women. I couldn’t believe this ninja thought she was just sitting at home waiting on him when he wasn’t there.
@Michele,
lol, put it this way. its not that we feel that the wang will keep you faithful, but that we have a decreased chance of keeping someone if we can’t satisfy her in the sack.
@The Champ
“its not that we feel that the wang will keep you faithful, but that we have a decreased chance of keeping someone if we can’t satisfy her in the sack.”
OOOOOHHHHH, you’re hella right about this right here! If it isn’t good, it makes it hard for me to want to go to the next level in the rltshp. I dunno, it’s just a turn off for me! I know this slays a man’s pride, and I’m not proud of it, so it makes me think that it’s better to just not go down that path so it doesn’t become an issue.
@Michele,
not a man who knows better…..
I am glad there are men in here who believe regular testing and STDs are important. Because (and here are some never before seen ratios and percentages) 90 in 100 men, 90% of the time think a visual or “sniff” test is real (no gyno) and have to be reminded, repeatedly, to wear condoms, and don’t bring them along even when they know sex is on the menu. So I think “most” men aren’t worried about diseases all that much. They just hate the idea that a woman they are attracted to, and that would be the envy of their boys, would be discovered to have and enjoy lots of sex, with someone else, before them. So it’s rarely about health concerns in my experience. Show me one man who’s serving up pap smears to every woman they meet as a sex precaution, and I’ll show you 50 that take one look at me, think I’m cute, educated and articulate and say hey, we dont need a condom. It’s dangerous and scary how many times this has happened, from degreed up negroes (no DeVry) who should know better. More and more, I’m the one who insists. Because I slept with enough dudes to know better.
@RocktheCatbox,
I really, really like you.
@Sula,
get a room
@The Champ,
Room Deez.
@Sula,
Thank you! When I start my blog you will get a personal invitation.
@Champ, you get a room. I’ll bring the hoochie skank rosé, and if your numbers are low enough, we can party.
@RocktheCatbox,
I enjoyed your post, because it’s real and relevant. STD’s can certainly be correlated with sexual partners as you just run more of a risk the more partners you have. But there are many folk who get infected on a first or second experience. Men do not like condoms. That is the bottom line. If you are not insistent, and many times even if you are, they will still try you. That, the fact that many people are asymptomatic, and passing things along uknowingly, as well as the difficulty of regulating human sexual behavior is why STD’s on the rise. There are folks on here right now living with an STD whether they know it or not.
maybe i’m not typical, but i really don’t care if a woman is “experienced”. how else do you think she learned that trick with her tongue that sends you over the edge every time? now i’m not saying i would wife a woman who had sex with the entire defense of the football team and half of special teams including the punter. i think there are two extremes. i don’t want to be with a virgin (i’m impatient and in no way want to be a teacher) and i don’t the town/city/campus/dorm slut. *shrug*
“in the (typical) man’s mind, this exaggerated sexual experience means that there’s an increased chance that he’ll be unable to please her, and, subsequently, unable to keep her faithful.”
-maybe i’m just that confident in where i think i’m going to please you regardless or at least do my best damn job trying. if she’s not happy still then oh well. *shrugs* lol
@Tunde,
maybe i’m not typical, but i really don’t care if a woman is “experienced”. how else do you think she learned that trick with her tongue that sends you over the edge every time?
i dont think most guys care if a woman is experienced. in fact, i’d say that the majority of us wanna be with someone who has an idea of what they’re doing. my point is that things get weird when a guy is made privy to exactly how and how many times his chick “got” experienced
@Tunde, Experience is a good thing but knowing that your girl is known as “Jawbone” by the fellas around your way or the Basketball team at her alma mater….will have me resending my offer for marriage….sorry just the way it is….we can still be friends tho……(and by friends I mean “exercise partners”)….(and by “exercise” I mean freaky sneaky)….(and by “freaky sneaky” I mean sex)
@Blacklaw, i would tend to say the same thing if i found out but i won’t say that’s a definite. we can all say what we will or won’t do but until we are actually in said situation i wouldn’t say its guaranteed i would act a certain way.
lol @ Jawbone…
Y’all want numbers. Here’s some numbers. If you are below the age of 22 (first of all, I’m a grown ass man and ain’t even checkin for these young’uns, but still) 5. That should be about one a year. If you are 25- 30 and never been married- 10 ( and I think that is the upper level). If you are 30-40 (my target range) 15. If you are over 40, who gives a sh*t! Everyone likes sex! But, If a chick is wifey material, she must have some self control. That should be in the eating department, clothes and shoe buying department and most definitely the chex department. Women, you can’t do what we do. It’s very simple. The only self control men have to have in regards to chex is to not rape women. Women do the rest for us. They take care of our self control. I don’t care if the guy is [name whatever good looking guy you want] he has had many women tell him no. If you look like, Kim Kardashian, or Gabby Union, or Amber Rose, NO man has ever said no to the nookie. Life is not fair, deal with it or just lie. “Men lie, Women lie, numbers don’t lie”.
@Slickback, you don t even have to look them brawds LOL, I had a mofo tell me he’d phcuk Medusa ..but that sounded good tho Slickback LLS…….A man needs some SELF control and some SELF discipline and some standards also, SMH
@OrangeStar616, “look like them brawds”
@Slickback,
Generally (cuz I generalize and shit), men who reference celebrities they’ll never date, combined with stringent and overly specific requirements for women’s behavior in the same paragraph (and arent being ironic about it) screams “I’m aggressively average looking and have a toddler sized wang.”
I know, not your intention and may not be true for you, but you’re welcome in advance.
@RocktheCatbox, LMAO!!!
@RocktheCatbox,
*snickering loudly*
@RocktheCatbox, Loving your comments!!!! Better school these brothers lol
@RocktheCatbox, got dang!-lol cheers! *raising my glass*
@RocktheCatbox,
Girl you on fire tonight!!! LOL
(But sooooo truuuuuue…..)
@RocktheCatbox,
Yeah, I’mma hafta delurk to cosign Sula upthread. Your Hanzo sword skills are quite sick. On behalf of the rest of us in our “could give a fuck” 30s, I thank you.
@Slickback, “If you are over 40, who gives a sh*t!”- ya’ll got me crying in here.
I’m not sure whether it’s the application of a double standard or the jumping to conclusions based on unsubstantiated rumors from his boys that’s more troubling in the above described scenario.
@klysha,
well, hurry up and choose. we dont have all day
@The Champ,
I suppose “choose deez” would be an inappropriate response given my lack of deez
@klysha,
I think it’s gender neutral nowadays. I see chicks slinging the phrase all the time. lol
Besides, Champ doesn’t either, but that doesn’t stop him!
I don’t know. I think saying men have no control over their own impulses is actually insulting to men, lol.What’s good is it sounds like equal amounts of sexism is being bandied about on both sides, and that alone makes me proud. On the real, if men were ruled by their sexual impulses in the way described above (like it’s a woman’s job to keep them in check, gtfooh), gender imbalances in positions of power, etc. would not exist. Patriarchy would die and men would be relegated to humping staircases and Cassie. If men can’t be held responsible for their own behavior because their brain is all impulse…each one of them would be riding the short bus.
@RocktheCatbox,
so basically, f*ck everybody?
@The Champ,
are you asking for permission?
jk, not sure what you mean. Expound, if you please.
And here I thought it was because men like to feel special. You know? Like she’s selective about who she gives her ‘cash and prizes’ to so if she has chosen YOU, you must be special.
@Ms. Smart,
You give them too much credit.
@Sula,
I agree! If she’s breaking me off, I feel special; despite who else she’s made feel special. The end.
@Caballeroso,
Now that’s the spirit!!
@Sula, I was being sarcastic.
@Ms. Smart,
Men are special…you know, in that “other” way.
@Ms. Smart, “special”? bwahahahahahaha- yeah right *eye roll*
I think people should just stick with “don’t ask, don’t tell” when it comes to numbers. Keep numbers to yourself. It can lead to people asking insecure questions like ” Am I the best?” or some bs like that. I prefer to ask the questions with the real answers, like “Can we go get tested together?”
@Passion,
Sure, if its a jump-off, who cares what the number is? but if you thinking of wifeying, or have already done so- you will at some point ask or at least wonder how many…
@Mr Dingo, Man,
Believe me as this grown ass woman will tell you…you don’t want to know. I know many friends who were happy ho’s turned housewives….
@ scorpio africanus,
Your comment right here is real talk. I will have to share this logic with folks.
Whether you believe it or not (or wanna believe it or not) – Numbers are important to men. You can scoff at the sentiment all you want but after you are done the fact will still remain – Numbers matter.
I will echo the sentiments of the other folks here who have mentioned that the “game” has just been illegally served up by Champzilla…take this knowledge and use it to better your life before this whole entry is taken down by the United Negro Too Much Disclosure Fund A.K.A. “Ninja Shut Up!”
@Brotha Tech,
Nobody debates the fact that numbers are important to men, What I (and it seems like many women here) debate is that men’s problem with numbers ought to then be a woman’s problem with numbers, and that somehow by revealing this overstated fact, it will better a woman’s life. Better my life, no. Make me mock the men with this issue, yes.
Hubris is a motherfucker.
Which you proved by saying “Numbers matter” but didn’t qualify it with a “…to me.”
@RocktheCatbox
I am going to further prove your point (and keep the joke running) by saying
qualify deez
@Brotha Tech,
LOL
…well if you can’t argue with what I said, I sho can’t argue with your nuts.
@Brotha Tech, lol….”real mature Rondell”
@Big Buck- u be one strong dude! marry an ex-porno chick?hats off to you man. reminds me of a story i read about this chick that had the worlds biggest gangbang (300 or so dudes in 24 hours)- she eventually married a school teacher who KNOWS about her past. mind boggles…
@Mr Dingo, Man,
I guess he is in the Hall of Fame of secure men. Better him than me. Although everytime I look at Luana her occupation deosn’t seem so bad.
*First time commenting*
In the words of Christina Aguilera and Lil’ Kim
“It’s a common double standard of society
The guy gets all the glory the more he can score
While the girl can do the same and yet you call her a whore”
Plain and simple…
As a woman, if you give a low #, you’re automatically a prude or “inexperienced”. If your # is considered high, you’re a jump off. It’s a lose-lose situation. Some dudes need to understand that women aren’t those Disney females who sits around waiting for “The One” aka Prince Charming. We got needs too. I’m not saying that it’s ok for women to run around having sex with ANY dude just because their puss puss is contracting; but, if a women is “experienced” she shouldn’t be condoned for that. That shouldn’t make her “unwifeable”. Also just because a woman knows some tricks in the bed doesn’t mean she’s been smashing homies from left to right. She could have gained her skills with just one dude. As long as you’re using protection, preventing unplanned pregnancy, and getting tested regularly, it really shouldn’t be a problem as long as you got standards.
The bottom line is that if a guy asks a woman how many dudes she’s been with, he must be an insecure mothaflower who wants to feel like The King. I say apply the don’t ask don’t tell policy. Like most people been saying, we’re in a century where we should be asking one another, “when was the last time you got tested? Can I see your test results please?” etc. Diseases don’t care who, what gender, how many you done… it’s all about self-control, and that goes for both species…
@T, lol @ “smashing homies”
@Michele- As man i say definitively i dont believe my d*ck would keep a woman to me. what would keep a woman is if she loves me and adores me and i keep upping my game WITH her and in all areas of my life. Its that simple really. And even then, if shes inherently an alley cat theres nothing you can do, really. she WILL play you.eventually.
Great post!
I think I’ma revise what I used to say about the power of a pns (alexis tyler stand up). People are afraid of what a pns can do. Or maybe it’s a sittuation where people are afraid of what intimacy can do. Like that song said, “it’ll turn you out yeeaaa”. So word is you may find it easy to put that fuhck face on for the other person that gave it to you in the past. We don’t want to end up conjuring up memories of them while we are pressent. I mean women are notorious for multi tasking and stuff. Even during coitous. Shucks some studdies have shown that their multi tasking have kept them from enjoying the going on coitous. Thus causing a thought that they need to go for 12 * the average coitous duration. & if they can guess what they had practice to go that long. JS
I say if a man can make the exception for the “perceived” whore (Kim Kardashian) or the porn star (Jenna Jameson) then the whole numbers game is BS!
A sexually sophisticated man is smart enough to know that pleasing a woman is so much more than how many men she has slept with.
It’s all about sexual compatibility and knowing that you are not going to be compatible with (read please) every single woman on the planet. And this simple fact does not take away from your ability.
Besides I think only sexually lazy and insecure men worry about the “numbers”.
@divalive,
In a nutshell.
To pile on with what others have said on the subject, I would point out that men with lots of sexual partners aren’t necessarily respected, e.g.:
(1) A guy that has 26 partners a year, but only because he blows 1/4 of his paycheck on prostitutes.
(2) A guy who only pulls morbidly obese and “differently abled” women.
The glory comes not from numbers, but pulling numbers of moderately-highly attractive women with relatively minimal effort compared to average. Since the assumption is that men have to put in more work than women similarly situated in order to put in work, the perception is that a man with big numbers has gained them via noble efforts, whereas a woman with high numbers has them because she’s loose.
This, of course, is unfair, but it is based on another social expectation, i.e., that men should be pursuers in the area of sensual relations. This expectation results in negatives for both genders. For men, as pointed out above, those with low numbers are clowned (see, e.g., the 40-Year-Old Virgin). For women, it’s that sensual relations are seen as a male conquest. And, for a lot of men, knowing that the woman that you put in mad work to “conquer” was “conquered” with far less efforts or under shady circumstances can leave one feeling salty (see the Dave Chappelle reference above).
So I agree that the disparate expectation for the genders in this area is unfortunate. But it doesn’t exist in a vacuum, and while some people here have transcended it (Cabelleroso, RocktheCatbox, and others), for those who haven’t it will take reevaluating the general expectations for the genders that people tend to buy into.
@Helagramki
Awesome.
@Anike Love and RocktheCatbox,
Thanks. I would like to also add, Anika, that I think that this quote from your blog sums up the source of a lot of modern male-female relationship issues:
“Am I caught up in the idea of having a man cater to my needs because he’s wearing my diamond-encrusted white gold wedding band? Do I hoot and holler about my lifetime membership in the Ms. Independent, Liberated, and Renaissance Black Women club, but expect my future man to uphold the old school, “traditional” roles as a good husband while I plan on subverting the “traditional” roles of a good wife?”
It’s a challenge for men as well to navigate these waters as boyfriends/husbands (i.e., being sufficiently assertive not to come off as a simp, but not so aggressive as to berepressive).
@Helagramki,
I fux with this.
I’d also like to go on record as saying if a woman’s number is high….she better be super head…..dont let me find out you been practicing your street ball skills since you were 13 and you still aint got no crossover
@Blacklaw,
*__________________*
This is classic.
@Blacklaw,
Flatlines! Bwahahahahahahaha!
@Blacklaw,
let the church say amen.
@Blacklaw, lmfao. PREACH it
@Blacklaw,
holla….you got that right…
@ Champ,
I agree and kind of on a different note, the men that I liked enough to hub (that’s right. If ninjas can wife, I can hub) were just okay in bed. Didn’t make my eyes roll backward, see visions of the messiah, etc.(As a disclaimer, I do not put up with sex fails…plenty of dudes have gotten a “hey this (angle/use of index finger/dickmove) isn’t working for me, so…”) It was just ok. We clicked, I liked having him around, and the sex, while fun, was not among my top 10. I knew better than to ever have said this to him (I’m only an asshole to people I dislike) and it was among the longest and best relationships I’ve had, it ended well. I can’t say I’m the only one who feels this way, either. So if you think you have to dickmatize the woman you love into staying with you, power to you (because honestly the idea of a dude working hard at laying pipe sounds and feels a lot better than the opposite), but you may have to quit your job, neglect your hobbies and reject basically all other parts of your life that make you a grown ass man in order to do this effectively, lol.
@RocktheCatbox,
I meant this to be a response to “do men think their dicks keep women faithful” thread. My bad, yo.
@RocktheCatbox,
i so f*cks with you….
@Scipio Africanus, well said homie the last two paragraphs was real spit……Lol @ Dummies guide to hypnosis from your line brother….Black fraternities always represented on vsb……Roo to the Bruhz
I never felt the need to ask a woman I was dating about her “numbers.” However, I’ve had women (dating or not) volunteer such information. The impression that I got was some women found pride only having had a few partners. In fact, it seems that women have some issue about the numbers divisible by 10 when it comes to this.
On a normal case, (meaning someone I just met) I wouldn’t care about their number at all. However, if it was an ex and after some time we got back into it, then thoughts about who she been with during the interim would cross my mind. Not enough to ask though.
A woman’s high # might not mean anything at all. It may only mean that she was bad or only OK at sex and dude didn’t want to go for another tour. I know some that definitely didn’t make it to a second tour. Also, if a woman has a high #, that doesn’t mean someone along the way showed her what to do/not do. I mean really, if a homie just want to smash, I don’t need to enroll her into my school.
EVERY guy just doesn’t want to be “that guy.” The guy who’s girl is known by all his past/present/future boys or even guys that he may have quasi-regular contact. I wonder… Do women with high #’s and been around a few blocks, pretend to be prude with a guy they care about?
@MeteorMan, Its not that women pretend to be a prude if they get with one guy they really care about… you just reach a point where you want stability and want to make “love”
When i was younger I didn’t value chex as much as i do now. So yeah i did some things im not necessarily proud of but when i got older i realized it was because i had a low self esteem and thought that guys wouldn’t want me if i wasn’t giving it up. i didn’t realize the power i had then and that actually the opposite is true.
I have no problem being honest about my past because i’m not ashamed of it. I’m not going to give anyone an exact number but I will be honest and say I didn’t value myself then the way I do now and I carry myself differently. So yea call me a “reformed hoe” if you want to (which is not the case) whatever i can care less what anyone thinks of my past its really not their business and any mature and secure man would never ask such a question to begin with.
As long as I’m clean and STD free, believe in monogamy, haven’t slept with any of your boys (or a whole sports team or frat line) – what else really matters?
@BKSweetheart,
So yea call me a “reformed hoe” if you want to (which is not the case) whatever i can care less what anyone thinks of my past its really not their business and any mature and secure man would never ask such a question to begin with.
As long as I’m clean and STD free, believe in monogamy, haven’t slept with any of your boys (or a whole sports team or frat line) – what else really matters?
Precise! Well said. That was exactly my point…
@BKSweetheart,
I understand where you are coming from and I kind of mentioned that in an earlier comment. I have met a few women that did the same thing you did and had the same issue and other issues. As a man you accept who she is now but at the same time you have to accept who she was at that time and whatever comes along with who she was.
@BKSweetheart,
Let’s say that there’s a “reformed hoe” formally known as jabberjaw. In the spirit of being “reformed,” she refuses to give her current SO head. And dude founds out, not only about her past, but how open minded she was sexually with other people opposed him.
Now before you scoff at my carefully constructed scenario, how does your logic account for situations like the one above? The idea of being “that guy” didn’t just spontaneous spring about one day before antiquity when guys were sitting around talking. It stems from the fear of not knowing someone in which you’re emotionally involved. In fact, for the person who’s (truly) “reformed,” how frequently do you say that former hoes disband certain sexual acts for their SO in the name of reformation? Put more concisely, what tokens of a “reformed hoe” past are used as symbols of their reformation? Not saying answer these questions like you’re the spokes person for H.A.A. Just some thoughts… It does happen…
@MeteorMan,
Let’s say that there’s a “reformed hoe” formally known as jabberjaw. In the spirit of being “reformed,” she refuses to give her current SO head. And dude founds out, not only about her past, but how open minded she was sexually with other people opposed him.
This reformed hoe named jabberjaw is also a stupid reformed hoe. Period.
@MeteorMan,
“EVERY guy just doesn’t want to be “that guy.” The guy who’s girl is known by all his past/present/future boys or even guys that he may have quasi-regular contact. I wonder”
This is what it basically comes down to. Most dudes don’t care about the past unless you were having trains ran on you frequently or were just extremely loose. You don’t want to be with a girl that EVERYONE dude in the past/present/future that you meet has had an experience with.
@The Champ “disappointed girl curses to herself, and begins to write and market memoirs about her experiences as a successful and single black woman.”
Hmmmmmmmm was this a not subtle dig at a recent VSB guest.. Cant believe no one commented on this
@BKSweetheart,
I saw it…lol Just wasn’t going there.
@BKSweetheart,
yep, it was foul but funny.
Thank you very much for pointing out all the nonsense man consider when choosing a girlfriend. The only worry one has to have is whether this girl is HIV+ or if she has got any STD. One thing which has never bother me is what the next brother did with the girl. I am my own self and just got to do what i got to do. To be honest I do not think a girl cums because of what she did with the next man four five weeks ago. We spend our time worrying about what a girl will say or feel but that is nonsense what is important is did you enjoy the sex period. Remember men we all different if mine bends to the left yours might be straight and where you hit inside a woman’s vagina is different and who knows probably she is not even bothered maybe she just needs you to aid her cum using her own fantasies so why waste time judging a woman by how many man she been with. This is just being shallow minded and naive to the fact that the most important thing is happiness and any way we all gonna die one day so just enjoy while it last period.
Warning: semi-ramble to follow.
A common theme I see here among some of the male posters (go back and count them if you don’t believe me), over and over, is this crippling fear of being made a fool of, of people laughing at them behind their back/to his face, of their boys having undesirable thoughts about him for being with Slutty Sally or what have you. The topic of insecurity (for both sexes) has been done to death here, but it is unintentionally funny to read only because it makes it painfully obvious that some men are really no less ruled by perceived social norms and stereotypes than some women, even though it would seem that “they (men)” make the “rules” about what’s acceptable (again, if someone else is making the rules and you follow them blindly and without question, are you really the master of your fate/in control of shit? hardly.) It’s kind of like, even though sterotypes about sexual behavior are/were created by men and supported by both men and women, it still doesn’t appear give men very much power, very much flexibility, bigger, heavier or hairier balls. It just makes them feel comfortable enough to make sweeping, snarky and cavalier comments about women. Which has, for me, the effect of an 8 year old putting on his father’s suit, going to his father’s place of business and chastizing his father’s employees. It’s assuming an authority (in this case, knowledge of all women, understanding how all women feel and act) that you haven’t grown into yet, while in life you want virtual strangers to think you’re the shit, and hope your peers, who may not even be your actual friends, approve of your dating choices. It sounds oppressive and a lil juvenile, don’t it? “I can’t be ‘that guy,’ or else I will never be able to show my face at sweet valley high again, and the hottest girl in school won’t let me wife her” I’m exaggerating, but that’s about the point; if your friends are that full of judgment and disapproval about the things you do (and this goes beyond dating), are taking the time to share that the girl you like may have slept with between 4 and 144 men, why do you call them friends? If you don’t call them friends, why entertain some douchebag’s gossip? There’s something sad and inherently bitchmade about the lupe fiasco stunt double in the opening scenario, although it was funny and had social relevance. I really liked the post, tho, it did bring me out of lurk mode since I’ve been reading for months, lol.
@RocktheCatbox,
sometimes it’s truly unfortunate that men have the penises as it seems that women, when they make sense, just make so much more of it……
you rock.
@empirestategirl,
“sometimes it’s truly unfortunate that men have the penises as it seems that women, when they make sense, just make so much more of it……”
sound a little like penis envy.
@Dave,
Let me share something with you Dave. For a woman, when Aint No Fun or Put it in your Mouth comes on the radio, or somebody at work pisses you off to no kotdamn end, or you get a speeding ticket, or your boyfriend acts a fool and you make up but you want to teach him a lesson in the bedroom…
sometimes…just sometimes..you get a lil dash of the envy. Don’t tell anyone!
Truth be told, I tell people all the time I wish I had a dick. I do! Is that bad? Sometimes I want to shut people up with it (swallow deez). Sometimes I want to grab it in public, as a retort when I don’t have a proper verbal comeback. Sometimes I just want to bounce it off a forehead, any forehead, just for the fuck of it.
I’m sure I’m not alone here. Don’t get me wrong, vaginas are great and I have found mine to be really useful. Dicks have better comedic timing.
@RocktheCatbox,
i knew it! i won’t tell if you don’t tell. your secret is safe with me lady.
love your answer and honesty, sister. and thanks for sharing. i know that you are not the only lady with a little bit of envy.i have dated a few. trust me im glad i have one….i almost envy myself…. if for no other reason but the easy access when i need to pee.
and i like vaginas too and respect there power and i’m so glad y’all got that. besides, every comedic duo needs a “straight man”.
@empirestategirl,
btw…thanks
I never have to worry about my “number” being an issue, thank goodness. However, finding a man that understands the difference between promiscuity and sexual inhibition (quantity vs quality) is a challenge.
I know it’s all late in the day, and you’re about to post up tomorrow blog… but I just wanted to add that it goes both ways….
I recently found out.. (by way of deception) how many partners one of my partners had… and it scared me… I swear… the one thing that popped into my head is how if you sleep with 1 person and that person slept with 10 people you’ve now slept with all 10…
It saddened me.. I always use protection. I care more for my protection, and it’s my responsibility to care for it.. but wow.. Homeboy had over 200 partners.. 200 PARTNERS…. so yea.. I think he’s a whore. I think he’s probably looking for an std. And now that I know I wish I can tell every girl that I know that he knows just how many partners that is. STD’s is men are asymptomatic, WHO KNOWS what this man has… he def isn’t husband material!!
Weeeeelllll I will be perfectly honest . . Im dat chick. My college days were wild and crazy . . and honestly . . I had a GREAT time. Im a Scropio and love and adore sex. However now that I am older, actually directly after college, I slowed waaaaayyyy down.
Yet based on what yall are on it sounds like I should just hang up the thought of being with a man. (Dont worry I still get men, cuz Im much MORE than my number) Which is funny because Ive met many men who want to be forgiven of their past. Yet yall are not willing to forgive ours. . .
BUT let me tell ya . . Ive met so many men who married that perfect lil woman to hate her 6 years later . . cuz she is boring. I also find it sad that men can let other men decide their happiness or lack there of . . . you spend time with a chick and enjoy it and leave her because of the FEAR of someone else saying something? That is sad that you will let others dictate your life.
Was this meant to depress women who already have quite a “number”? I understand why it would matter to a man. As women, with any kind of sex, we take the person in and that’s a big deal. Much more of an emotional situation that it is with a man. And it’s not far that the sexual scales are so much different for men and women but as a woman are we suppose to think we don’t deserve love at all? There’s no chance to change?
Thanks for this very informative post by the way. I’m still not satisfied with the rationale, but hey, men are just as irrational as men.
And really, for those with a ‘number’ it is depressing. More so because even if at some point you were that h*e, you may not STILL be that h*e.
I had a scarily similar experience where a guy’s ‘friend’ gave him a heads up, when we had only been dating a good week or so, that he saw me at a party with a next dude.
I’m not too concerned though because even though I don’t know which friend that was, one of his close buddies kept trying to smash me…I think he laid off when my guy gave him a graphic account of what we did. Oh well
The same worries can be true for women.
Lets say you’re a good girl and keep your “number” down in the single digits. Then you meet a dude you’re crazy about. You have the “what’s your number” convo and find out he’s basically been CROPDUSTING his seed all over the United States (possibly worldwide, but we know men only count “domestic puzzy” in their “number”).
What’s a girl to do then? Sure, he meets all the other requirements you have on your list, but that’s what’s made him so attractive to every Pam and Jamie and Sandra he ever met and he “gifted” them and any other chick he met with a little of his “white lightning” all to live up to some prehistoric stereotype.
What’s worse, is that since Chris Rock is correct and men can’t go backwards sexually, you know you’ll have to be pulling tricks from Cirque du Soleil to keep a dude with a high “number” happy. And the moment you say, “Nah, that’s not really my style”, you can bet he has those “old friends” saved in his speed dial to visit whenever you’re not up to the job.
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