Depth.
I wonder if white people walk into a room full of white people and notice that everybody is, ya know, white?
I know I do (I’m Black though). Everytime I walk into a room where the overwhelming majority of people are white I not only notice but I look for the other person(s) of color in the room. Of course, once I notice them, we spend the the duration of time that we’re in said location pretending not to notice one another.
But we notice. Oh, how we notice. I’m sure that white people would do it as well if they walked into a room full of coloreds. But that’s mostly because they’re in jail at that point and it’s going to be lights out pretty soon for them anyway.
Lights out?!? That’s a pun and I didn’t even intend it. There should be a term for those puns that people accident-upon. Something like: no pun intended.
That’d be swell.
This “recognition-lack of recognition” of one another makes me realize something: Black people are screwed. We have the worst sense of unity of any other cultural group; I’m convinced of it. I went to both an HBCU and a big ole’ white public state school on the East Coast. At HBCU’s there’s no rush to speak or even notice all the Black people since we’re in such abundance; never mind that it’s a completely false representation of the real world and that it shouldn’t be taken for granted that we’re in the midst of likeminded individuals who can actually read and aren’t afraid of information at the same place at the same time. Yet, we gloss over the importance and landmark-ism of it all.
It’s college, who the f*ck cares. Give me my hours and give me my degree. F*ck you, pay me.
Amazing how many people long for that constant recognition of successful driven Black people once they graduate (unless you went to Morehouse since ninjas apparently don’t graduate from there much) and re-enter the world we’re all more familiar with — you know, the world where its hard as hell to find the professional Black crowd and we’re often left longing for the intellectual stimulation that comes along with late night arguments about which A Tribe Called Quest album was better, The Low-End Theory or Midnight Marauders.
It’s Midnight Marauders, by the way. You can disagree but you will be wrong.
At our HBCU’s we see eachother but we don’t really notice one another. We’re just all there so we assume we’ll always be there – don’t know what you’ve got ’til it’s gone kind of thing.
And then we have the big state schools were there’s usually a handful of coloreds who STILL make all attempts NOT to notice one another. When I went to Big A** State University, every time I’d see a Black person I’d speak. Hell, we had the same struggle. We were pepper sprinkles in a big ass cauldron of salt. Not just that, but filled with lots of salt that didn’t really want much peppering.
Ignored.
Constantly.
At first I took it personal. Why on earth would these mother*ckers have the audacity to not respond back to me saying “hello?” These northern bastards. Then I realized that its part of the what we all do, even amidst times when we should have unity. We spend time noticing but not noticing one another as if to act like we don’t need to.
We have no unity. We have no unity when we’re unified and we have no unity when we should have unity and the opportunity exists. I don’t give a damn if I’ve never met you in life. If I walk into a KKK meeting and I see a Black cat you better believe I’m going to notice him since we have a common struggle.
Assuming I’m at a KKK meeting our common struggle is probably literally a struggle but hey, common is common.
Sometimes I’ll go out of my way to speak to the other Negroes in a room. Of course, then we look like a gang which is never a good thing when you’re in the midst of a bunch of people who know how to dial 911 and don’t think that 911 is a joke.
Our lack of unity, which is partially caused by our rise in social and economic status — face it, we don’t all have the same struggle anymore — is ultimately our downfall. We want equality but we all won’t even get on the same page in a room full of people who don’t look like us. Hell, we don’t even know what book each other’s reading. Are we even supposed to be reading the same book?
Would we even notice?
Deep.
-VSB P aka THE ARSONIST aka TANGLE JIG P aka GIIIIIIIIIRL, HE A 3
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{ 322 comments… read them below or add one }
i was just talking about this today, but particularly about the absence of a young, professional, african american community– and also how when a group of blk people get togther in a crowd of 2520s, whther at a school in a neighborhood, or wherever, we are deemed to be culturally isolating ourselves– i think this is a major part of the problem–no one ever talks about white ppl banning together/living/ organizing together as an issue becuase whiteness is the status quo and hardly ever challenged.
@PrincesMo,
i dunno why this posted twice, sorry
@PrincesMo,
i absolutely feel you on this….there is so much stigma around us gathering (gets back to jim crow and earlier) that i find myself getting angry about it! i mean, why should four or five black people together be so intimidating to a damned congregation of 2520s?? what exactly do they think we’re plotting?
@shatani,
Man this sh1t pisses me off! At my previous job, some white person would have the nerve to ask “why are you guys sitting here all by yourselves – you should mingle”. So it’s not mingling until you are in the mix with some yt’s I suppose. All the white people would be a-mingaling with each other and no one would bat an eyelid! To hell with that sh1t!
@YGB,
Tell it! I actually changed careers because of this. Once upon a time I was positioning myself for a pretty lucrative career in media sales (easy six figures by age 26, and none of the time commitment associated with finance/medicine/law). I sold well, I had a solid network, blah, blah, blah. But in this highly unprofessional environment (esp. since I was one of only a few women) I decided not to partake of their afterhour reindeer games (straight up grown ass frat boy ish). Don’t you know my boss brought up the fact that I didn’t hang out at the bar long enough with them as an area for improvement at my performance review. I was at happy hour, chilling with the coloreds. Don’t shoot me just cause I dont wanna do car bombs on a Tues.
Its like this sense of entitlement where I’m supposed to ingratiate myself to them even long after the clients have gone home, otherwise I seem like I’m “not happy here”. They tried pulling that same bullish on the Asian dude (who happened to be my office bestie) despite us pulling more than our fair share with the people we actually shoulda been reaching out to…the clients! I left. He got laid off. SOB’s!
@Me fail english?,
*fist up*
Did the same thing too….
A. I spend enough time around y’alls bullsh!t as it is
B. Your life ain’t my life…..
C. I’m out
@KingPine,
i like how you lay out your points! cuts right to the chase!
I have witnessed this phenomenon…I went to a small state school with a small black population and we all knew each other but spent most of our time trying to avoid being “the stereotype”…I think this happens a lot when we are in the majority we take it for granted and when we are in the minority we try to be as non assuming as possible. I went through that my freshman and sophomore year and as a jr/sr I realized that I cant do anything but be me and love all that i am the things that reinforce the stereotype AND the things that bust it wide open. I still speak when I see another black person and I think of all black people whether they chose to acknowledge it or not as my kin in this struggle. The memphis city school superintendant gave a speech in which he said “freedom is a hard fought thing, and each generation has to earn it again”. I agree and therefore all of my black people are fighting for our generations freedom..I hope I never get to ahead of my self or to removed from who and where I came from that I forget that…..
@shay_d_lady, “freedom is a hard fought thing, and each generation has to earn it again”. I agree and therefore all of my black people are fighting for our generations freedom..I hope I never get to ahead of my self or to removed from who and where I came from that I forget that…..
Amen!
@shay_d_lady,
How would associating with each other though lead to ‘stereotypical’ behaviour? I’m genuinely curious.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
well, speaking from personal experience, there seems to be a common belief among some white folks that black people only want to be around other black people, and that when we are together we talk about how much we hate them.
*hears carly simon singing “you probably think this song is about you” in my head*
@shatani,
yeah, we had a lot of (unsuccessful) dialogue about this in my undergrad. i was at a private, predominately white school, and all (well, majority) of the black folk would sit and clown together whenever we had a meal. there were only about 60 of us per graduating class, so we felt the need to share some kind of time together, if only briefly, during the day. a frequent question at any forum where we had open dialogue about race was “why do all the black kids sit together in the union?”
ironic how this came out during my years there: http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Why-Are-All-the-Black-Kids-Sitting-Together-in-the-Cafeteria/Beverly-Daniel-Tatum/e/9780465083619
@peachi,
i LOVE this book! i have it and it was also one of the required texts for my diversity class in grad school. im telling you, nothing brings out 2520 people’s TRUE thoughts about other races like a good ole fashioned diversity class. i saw some true colors that semester and it changed my perspectives on a LOT of people.
@shatani,
Hmm, Sounds like watching Roots. I’m glad I only took one Soci class. Blood pressure woulda shot through the roof!
@shatani,
“there seems to be a common belief among some white folks that black people only want to be around other black people, and that when we are together we talk about how much we hate them.”
i notice black people think this about hispanic people, especially when they’re speaking spanish.
@shay, I don’t. but that’s probablly b\c I went to ahigh school dominated by latinos and spent alot of times in the Heights
@shay,
Most races/ethnic groups/cultural entities tend to think that about other people who are not their race/ethnic group/cultural entity… Especially when said group is in the majority.
@shay,
I think that’s more when they are speaking English, then suddenly switch languages when you get closer.
@Nikiloveli,
completely off topic…
holla at cha girl…
missladee622@gmail.com
@shatani,
black people only want to be around other black people, and that when we are together we talk about how much we hate them.
lol…this isn’t true?
@The Champ,
not EVERY time! sometimes we just wanna talk about Girlfriends of The Game or the latest Tyler Perry abomination!
@shatani,
I’m starting to think I just might be a tad bit prejudice cuz I don’t really want to hang with the 2520s… At all. LOL
“This “recognition-lack of recognition” of one another makes me realize something: Black people are screwed. We have the worst sense of unity of any other cultural group; I’m convinced of it.”
The degree of it depends on where you live, but in general this is true. I’ve worked in upstate NY, DC, and Seattle and tried to get involved in the community of each city. The worst was upstate NY where black people would not support each other and put no effort in anything. There was no sense in community. This is gonna sound strange considering the lack of color in the NW, but I actually find the most unity in Seattle specifically for the African American population that relocated here from other cities to work for companies like Boeing, Microsoft, etc. One girl that went to Howard lives here and hosts dinners at her house every Thursday night and a big percentage of the African American professionals in Seattle get together and there’s a strong bond between us. People are very active in the community and we’re starting a non-profit to help disadvantaged youths. I’m 30 years old and this is the first time that I can honestly say that I felt a connection to the African American population in my community.
@Leila,
The worst was upstate NY where black people would not support each other and put no effort in anything. There was no sense in community.
Playing devil’s advocate:
Why should one feel a sense of community based on ethnicity/race/gender etc? Maybe the communities in upstate NY align themselves on other factors rather than race. I don’t know, I think this notion of ‘race based communities’ perturbs me a wee bit. It’s based on something we have no control over
@ofloveandotherdemons, NY is a very diverse state and I have friends from all different backgrounds including race, culture, economic, etc. But at the same time, race connects people and it’s important to know your identity. My point wasn’t to always align yourself with all black people at all times, but I grew up in upstate NY and it seemed like a lot of black people did not support each other’s events. One of my friends was trying to change the vibe by creating events catered towards young black professionals which didn’t exist at the time. Instead of receiving support from the black community, he had a lot of haters who did now want to succeed. This seemed to be common and it was sad because I did not see the same thing occurring in other communities. There’s a lack of unity in black people at times like Panama said in his blog.
@Leila,
I live in Seattle, too. Black folks are pretty welcoming–except for the professional set downtown. They break their necks trying not to see you, so i’m pretty sure they don’t want to say anything. However, I spend most of my time in the CD, and damn if people don’t mean-mug you to death. (half joking.) don’t get me started on the guys who feel they can call you out just because you’re both black, never mind that they ain’t coming correct. Organizing is sometimes difficult because people be carrying on grudges. Mostly, though, the black people that I work and hang with want to get together and are openly down for creating black-only spaces, or at least POC-only spaces (we are, after all, in the PNW).
Going out is entirely a different story, though, because black guys here only have eyes for the white chicks. I have to go to African or Caribbean places to find guys who are glad to see me. In the end, though, I’m looking to leave. There just aren’t enough of us around up here, period. (except in Tacoma but that place is too small!)
@Leila,
That has been my experience with Seattle as well. Our company even had a Black diversity committee where the new hires (like I was) would be shown around the city (the hot spots) by the older black employees.
I truly did love Seattle.
*** Applause*** I’m in awe of this post, TANGLE JIG P aka GIIIIIIIIIRL, HE A 3! It’s great… And this is SOOO real! How about when you work for a company that has a sprinkling of black people and there is one HR rep who is assigned to your division and happens to also be black but won’t return your phone calls or follow up on your issue because they’re SCARED. It is crazy, and constantly makes me think of the challenges that Black folks of previous generations faced to get us here and how so many of us turn our backs on each other these days out of fear. Fear of seeming too “black” in front of white counterparts like there’s something wrong with it… but then again, when you go home… there’s the fear of seeming too “white” to the friends and family members who aren’t members of the talented tenth… oh the duality of the modern Negro.
@pgh muse,
I’ll just co-sign because I suspect there will be a lot of posts. I agree with you. I was awe struck by the post as well. Great insight Panama. This has been the story of my life since university and now I live in Japan.
“there’s the fear of seeming too “white” to the friends and family members who aren’t members of the talented tenth”
LOL. A friend and I call these folks the “officials.” They’re the keepers of Negritude.
@Ms. Hall, LOL. A friend and I call these folks the “officials.” They’re the keepers of Negritude.
lol… I’ve got maaad stories about the antics of people on both sides of this…the ones from the talented tenth who forget that you knew them when they were just “Peaches” when ya’ll were kids, and from those whose first sentence after you say “Hi” is “Don’t be using all those big words when you talkin’ to me…” I can’t help it tho… that’s just how I talk. Dang. Ne who,VSB is the debil incarnate…
@pgh muse,
i wanna hear some stories! i know all about those, “oh, so what? you wanna cookie?!?!” type folks….the officials, as i am going to now call them, are on patrol all the time!
A friend and I call these folks the “officials.” They’re the keepers of Negritude.
LOL i love it!!! “officials” are the worst tho…
@Gem @ the NBGSA Conference, my uncle calls these folks the ‘head n*ggas in charge’. HNIC, for short. I’ve got one at my job and she seems to go out of her way to hire the most incompetent people of color she can. Not only does she do her job poorly, but she seeks out other people to poorly represent people of color (blacks and latinos) to the masses. All of the people she hires come with the complete package of teeth sucking, neck rolling, eye rolling and no home training when they talk to patients. it gets on my last nerve.
@Miss Patterson,
my uncle calls these folks the ‘head n*ggas in charge’. HNIC, for short
this is original.
@The Champ
You’re such a smart azz
@Ms. Hall,
“there’s the fear of seeming too “white” to the friends and family members who aren’t members of the talented tenth”
LOL. A friend and I call these folks the “officials.” They’re the keepers of Negritude.
***writing term and definition down in my mental lexicon***
@pgh muse, exactly! the black woman that was acting distant from me is the 2nd in command in my department and is scared to stand up for her workers. There was an error with my check and I brought it to her attention and she said she would handle it. I followed up with an e-mail two days later do you think she responded.. no. And she ducked and dodged me so I went to the dept myself. There was a latin woman that worked in accounting and she told me that my boss is scared to confront the big cheeses when she or others in the dept have been wronged. That is ridiculous.
@Satya,
its really such a crappy situation…especially for the black HR rep. because the minute youre perceived as “playing favorites” for other PoC, then every damn thing you say and do is colored (pun intended). its almost as if you are summarily disregarded as some “negro activist” who is “too sensitive”
@shatani,
its almost as if you are summarily disregarded as some “negro activist” who is “too sensitive”
I think some black people try extra hard to make it seem like they are ‘over’ our history. Although I do not think it’s OK for black people to use race as the root cause of all their issues, it is important to acknowledge that we do have a history. Because of this, I also always speak to other people of color in the room, esp. when we’re the minority. For the “official,” the simple act of saying ‘hello’ to another person of color in a room full of white people makes them self-conscious… “God forbid they think I’m talking about slavery… I’ll just ignore you–safer that way.”
@EssenceBK,
“God forbid they think I’m talking about slavery… I’ll just ignore you–safer that way.”
Lol. I never got this logic on some people. You think by not acknowledging me they’ll up and forget that you’s colored??
Not only do they still notice, but now they don’t respect you, dummy. I’m not coming to work in Dashiki’s and afro puffs but I’ll be damned if I aint taking MLK day off cuz my black ass thought I was “passing”. They can think what they want. If your boss is prejudiced, they probably already had their mind made up that you’re plotting the revolution anyway.
@Me fail english?,
Amen on this whole post!
Interesting and true post. My freshmen year of college I went to an interesting school. It wasn’t an HBCU but 2520s were the minority. There were black folks, Africans, Asians etc.. and everyone got along pretty well. The groups you’d see in the dining hall were very mixed. Now i’m at a PWI that does have a decent minority population, but it’s very different. In the different dining areas the minority students are congregated together and the white kids are together and no one seems to really integerate unless they are in a club together (which is rare because the minority kids are usually in “ethnic clubs” (Haitian society, Black Student Association etc…) or had a class together.
I’m not gonna lie sometimes I do look around when i’m in a new setting and try spot the other “coloreds”. When I started working @ my lawfirm and was in training I made the effort to talk to the 2 other black ppl in my dept. 1 was warm an inviting the other tried to act all removed like she wasn’t down with the bonding process. Two weeks at the job she asked me if i could give her my hair dressers # as she’d like to make an appt lol.
Sorry so long. Let’s be more unified folks and a little nicer. Especially when we’re the pepper sprinkles
@Satya,
My freshmen year of college I went to an interesting school. It wasn’t an HBCU but 2520s were the minority.
Did you go to Temple?
@Dorian G., no. I went to University of Bridgeport. Small crummy school but it’s a unique place
@Satya,
I didn’t even know Bridgeport (Connecticut right?) had a university!
@Dorian G.,
TU Mutha…. Lol. Couldn’t resist. Lol
@Ms. Sassy,
welcome and sh*t
@Ms. Sassy,
You watching the game on friday?
@Satya,
welcome and sh*t (i think)
I was recently walking through a hospital w/my brother (shortly after my niece was born) and couldn’t help but notice how many strangers he acknowledges everywhere he went; I also couldn’t help but notice that they were all black. When white people walked by, nothing; when a brother/sister walked by, he wouldn’t hesitate to acknowledge them…even if he was mid-sentence.
This made me extremely aware, and perhaps for the first time, of the fact that I DO NOT do this and then I had to question myself as to why. I attempted to justify by saying that b/c I’m (1) usually walking alone, (2) relatively low-key, (3) precautious b/c I’m a SBF, it’s not that I’m an a$$hole, I’m just conditioned to act a certain way. Damn. Conditioned? So…I only speak when I’m spoken to? Have I really been trained to be seen and not heard? Wtf?…liberation is just my illusion. That’s some deep shit.
Tangent: I once knew this mixed dude in high school who was considered, for all intent and purpose, black. Extremely popular, varsity point guard, dated the cutest (black) girls, garnered the respect of everyone, seemed comfortable in his skin. He graduated a year before me and we ended up going to the same state school…and in a year’s time, he’d switched his whole game up. Straight Abercrombie & Fitch, Birkenstocks, wore glasses instead of contacts, traded his close-cut for a curly fro, didn’t talk to anyone from his past (to avoid their stares, I’m sure), completely embraced his whiteness to – what I considered – his own detriment. The year 2000…and dude was “passing.” I was amazed.
@Resident GRitS,
I would have called that mofo out quick…
@Resident GRitS,
Negros are still ‘passing’ in one way or another. Disgusting.
SMH.
Bond. BlkBond.
@Resident GRitS,
So…I only speak when I’m spoken to? Have I really been trained to be seen and not heard?
lol, maybe you’re just an assh*le
N*ggas need to get over themselves. Point. Blank.
@Monk,
lol…this is probably the latent theme beneath most of our topics here
Yo I don’t even feel the need to recognize and respond to this post as I’m clearly above all y’all ni**as.
@Dorian G.,
go sat down somewhere. Yes…sat.
@Dorian G.,
*giggle* *giggle* *snort*
I like snarkiness.
@Dorian G.,
off topic 100% did you ever hook up that happy hour thing in l.a ?
@maria,
LOL how am I supposed to set up a happy hour when I know nothing about the area???
If you’re in the LA area this week, send me an email: graywords1000@yahoo, and we’ll set up a happy hour.
@Dorian G.,
LMAO!
@Dorian G.,
LMAO! I think I like you!
@YGB,
Don’t worry, its a natural reaction when you’ve been exposed to me. Trust me I’ll do something to ruin it within 90 days or so lol.
@Dorian G.,
there is definitely something to be said for consistency!
@Dorian G.,
hahahaha! Way to lower expectations!
@Dorian G.,
I knew one of you (either you or Monk) would act ig’nant up in this piece.
I see you both have not let me down.
First, well written, punny post, PJ. Kudos.
Second, maybe I live on another planet but I have not, luckily, witnessed this phenomenon. Having grown up in mostly black neighborhoods (in New Orleans, then Chicago) I am used to being around all black folk during the day. In elementary school, I went to a school where my brother and I and some other kid were the only black kids there (high school was different… I proudly, and by choice, went to a mostly black urban high school. My parents didn’t understand, lol.).
Back to my point: My first two years of college were at an HBCU, my last two at a creative arts college where the majority of the student body was white kids with multiple body piercings and rainbow colored mo-hawks.
At the HBCU, kids were quick to speak and befriend each other. Of course, the speaking and befriending was clique and social status based, but folks noticed each other and realized how special it was to be among other folks who looked like them, could read and had big dreams.
At the creative arts college, black students definitely sought each other out and even banned together when some shady, racist ish went down in the name of creative expression.
In Chicago, where I live, and New Orleans where I spend a lot of time, I am part of really, strong vibrant social and professional networks. Folks get together for fun or in the name of planning the next movement (most of my friends are community organizers!) but the acknowledge and respect the fact that we, college educated black folk are rare while still acknowledging the reality that most of our peers haven’t been so lucky.
I go to a lot of theatre and art gallery events and there are rarely more than a handful of dots (i.e. black folk) there. But the ones who are there make it a point to speak to each other.
In the N.O., I hang with black folk who, after partying it up on some Mardi Gras/Zulu tip go to networking and charity events and organize rally’s to protest the city’s lack of interest in developing poorer areas in the city.
Maybe you should move.
@iloVEGrits,
Second, maybe I live on another planet but I have not, luckily, witnessed this phenomenon
its not that you live on another planet, its just that, from what you’ve said, you travel in art-sy, community organizing-ey, diversity championing-ey circles, so, chances are, you’re gonna be around more open-minded and unpretentious people.
@iloVEGrits,
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe it’s a south central/midwest thing. I attended a small university in East Texas and had a similar experience. Even as early as freshman orientation, the black students were eager to speak and share with newer students tips on how to survive in such a school. Some of my friends are convinced I attended an HBCU because of the stories I share about my school days. It’s because there was a close network of Blacks on campus that began as soon as I stepped on the campus. Even my friends who stayed in Oklahoma and went to larger white schools, said that other blacks were eager to meet them and for the most part would stick together on campus; racial issues or not. This is why the BSA/BSO of most of the schools was the strongest organization on the campus.
Maybe it’s because we’re so excited to see one another. Growing up and living in the south central/midwest is crazy. You almost have to latch on to someone who looks like you in order to survive. And we learn that from jump… like elementary school…shameful, huh. Sometimes it feels as though nothing has changed since the 60′s in this part of the country. But I digress…sorry.
‘Pepper sprinkles’ has definitely been my dominant experience since I arrived in the states. Even though I was in a state school with a huge black student population (black internationals also) for my undergrad, the major I choose had predominantly white students. Needless to say, this was quite the shock for me coming from an environment where 99.8% of the population looked like me, straight into the ‘pepper sprinkle’ phenomena (there was a maximum of three students in every sophomore-senior course that I took). The other black students’, in the department, behavior, from my experience, fell in with their nationality; African Americans were either: cautiously friendly, openly hostile or indifferent, while the other two black internationals and I stuck to each other like glue.
When I moved down to the OC for graduate school, I was convinced for the first three months that they had banned all blacks from the county and the only reason I was residing there is that I had somehow managed to fall through the cracks. Seriously, I saw exactly five black people in my first two months here. I was freaking out. Yeah, and the college I attended had a 1% black student population according to the 2007 student body census. Anyway, I’m so used to being the pepper sprinkle in the sea of salt that I hardly check for other chocolate bunnies in the vicinity.
Honestly, though, 99.9% of the time, any fellow Africans that I’ve met not only do not ignore me but I usually end up with an invitation for tea or lunch within an hour of meeting them. I think the commonality of being an immigrant far outweighs every other concern, i.e. avoiding stereotypical behavior, appearing non-threatening or blending in with the status quo.
I’ve always felt that minorities born in the USA or raised here for most of their childhood always seem to be walking a tight rope between appeasing their own community and dealing with the world at large; maybe this is one of the reasons for the “recognition-lack of recognition” act.
@ofloveandotherdemons, what is your major?
I’m a history major and at my school i’ve encountered 5 black students in major classes. There were a bunch in the core history classes but somewhere between HIS 1000 and 2800 they all vaporized.
@Satya,
Chemistry/Math, as an undergrad. The Math dept. was 97% filled with kids with origins in some part of Asia, and the Chem dept. was mostly all white.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
so very well put. i think the “strangers in a strange land” phenomenon is much stronger. i, too, have been the pepper sprinkle (or the lone chococalte chip, as i call myself) for the majority of my life….i wouldnt say that i dont look for other black people, i always do. but im not particularly uncomfortable if there are none.
on the idea of acknowledgment, there is also something to be said for regional behavior. im from boston…blackness aside, people do not readily greet strangers where im from (short of those in the service industry and even that is hit or miss!)…so, its not my first inclination to greet anyone, black or otherwise. it feels weird to me. i will always respond in kind, but i go on the assumption that folks who dont know me dont really want to talk to me until theyve shown me otherwise.
@shatani,
“so, its not my first inclination to greet anyone, black or otherwise. it feels weird to me. i will always respond in kind, but i go on the assumption that folks who dont know me dont really want to talk to me until theyve shown me otherwise.”
I know exactly what you mean. What’s wierd is that I come from a culture that demands greeting people, even if you don’t know them. My mom always used to say that all you owe people is a greeting. She’s ashamed I don’t do it anymore.
@lulu,
right! a friend of mine who was born and raised in alabama feels relief being up north for school because she felt that pressure to greet people. she hated that obligation to stop and chat with people lest you be considered rude and you KNOW it’ll get back to your parents! she loves not doing it anymore…
@lulu,
For me greeting people (blacks specifically) is so much in me that I don’t even think about it. Where I’m from it’s rude to walk into a room and find someone there and not acknowledge their existence (even if you don’t know them)!
@YGB,
i walk into work like that every day! lol…ive always said, im just not neighborly.
@shatani,
Yeah, the regional thing is definitely true. When I was in Texas, especially rural, hick filled TX (east Texas, Dallas not so much) strangers were more likely to start conversations with you on the street. California, not so much….Yeah, I’m not the overly friendly type. I don’t want to talk to your arse when I’m in the store picking up some cantoloupes. Leave me the ell alone. I do miss the random ‘sugar’ and ‘honey’ from the little old ladies I’d meet.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
My experience has been pretty similar to yours. Actually very similar.
I think the commonality of being an immigrant far outweighs every other concern, i.e. avoiding stereotypical behavior, appearing non-threatening or blending in with the status quo.
This is the reason why most of the best friends I’ve made in the US have some sort of immigrant heritage. They’re either immigrant themselves and/or first-generation immigrants. Against all odds, I had more in common with my Indian colleague who would always be on the lookout for cheap calling cards to call her folks in New Dehli or my Thai friend whose mom is always bringing relatives over… naturally we became closer friends.
@Ms. Sula,
that usually happens no matter where you go…i found myself connecting with other americans (and canadians) when i was abroad, regardless of their race….
@Ms. Sula,
True, I usually feel some sort of connection with fellow immigrants (VISA holders especially). I know we are both jumping through the same hoops. All my really close friends, with the exception of two, are of Indian descent. It just sort of ended up that way. If I click with some one, I click with them; all the other stuff race, religion, gender, is not that big of a deal to me.
Helluva post. Back when I was locked in the purgatory known as Phoenix Arizona, the “notice” was soooo important. I think (trying to remember numbers I swear I read before we moved) that Phx is 60% white, 25% hispanic, 6% black, the rest other. It was surreal when we saw another black person, we would look from miles down the road, see a loc or a fro or some other blackness in the shadow, and scream wassup like no one else was around. The awkwardness came when you were in proximity with the other captured brethren. There was this sense of trying to force unity even if it was clearly obvious that the 300lb black man in front of you at the counter that ordered a triple cheese whopper was clearly, not interested in being vegan. Or giving a bald man your card and you…cut hair.
FFWD to my move to the east coast and the images of poetry spots and black unity and I find myself more obscure here, in chocolate city, than I did in the abyss of Little Mexico.
@Saule Wright,
1.) …you at the counter that ordered a triple cheese whopper was clearly, not interested in being vegan
Woot, woot, fellow vegan? I think that makes three now at VSB.
2.) FFWD to my move to the east coast and the images of poetry spots and black unity and I find myself more obscure here, in chocolate city, than I did in the abyss of Little Mexico
How so?
3.) I mentioned somewhere in a thread above, but I’m not 100% convinced on this unity based purely on the basis of my blackness. It doesn’t seem to account for all the intricacies and quirkiness of individuals.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
1) I’m closer to the man at that counter than the vegan, sorry to disappoint.
2 and 3) I feel like I’m always being evaluated (this feeling is usually validated by overheard comments as I pass). I’m always being picked apart by the people I wanted to be united with when I moved here. Then again, like you said in 3) I have my own …issues.
@Saule Wright,
Danngnabbit. We are down to two once more; that’s ok, more tofu for me. I’m sorry about the constant scrutiny. You’ll find a group that you click with though. Trust, I’m pretty ‘strange’ and I’ve still managed to find a group of friends (blacks and non-blacks) that love me despite or because of all my quirks. If that doesn’t work, let me know and I’ll email my three step friendship applications. The criteria are very lax; 99.9% of all applicants are accepted.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
Well, once I find some that don’t scrutinize me, I end up scrutinizing myself. Terrible terrible.
@Saule Wright,
i truly feel what youre saying about feeling evaluated (and then having confirmation as you pass) and thats how i have always felt around other black people, which is sad.
@Saule Wright,
@Saule Wright,
Danngnabbit. We are down to two once more; that’s ok, more tofu for me. I’m sorry about the constant scrutiny. You’ll find a group that you click with though. Trust, I’m pretty ‘strange’ and I’ve still managed to find a group of friends (blacks and non-blacks) that love me despite or because of all my quirks. If that doesn’t work, let me know and I’ll email me three step friendship applications. The criteria are very lax, 99% of all applicants are accepted.
@Saule Wright,
“I feel like I’m always being evaluated (this feeling is usually validated by overheard comments as I pass). I’m always being picked apart by the people I wanted to be united with when I moved here.”
Sounds like you’ve had a few run-ins with the “officials.” As a native I can tell you that they own sections of Chocolate City. It is easy for them to flourish as the city is pretty segregated. However don’t lose any sleep over those fools and don’t despair. I am sure that you’ll find your niche and it will include like minded – read tolerant- black people. Giiirl, eat your tofu.
@Saule Wright
“It was surreal when we saw another black person, we would look from miles down the road, see a loc or a fro or some other blackness in the shadow, and scream wassup like no one else was around. ”
This visual is hilarious.
@Saule Wright, “It was surreal when we saw another black person, we would look from miles down the road, see a loc or a fro or some other blackness in the shadow, and scream wassup like no one else was around.”
I was in Phoenix for a week and this explains a lot. Every black person went out of their way to say hi to me lol.
@Leila,
phoenix is easily the cleanest city ive ever been to. i know this has nothing to do with the topic. i just wanted to share
@The Champ,
if you don’t count rock debris and dust, sure.
@Leila,
glad you got out. lol
@Saule Wright,
“It was surreal when we saw another black person, we would look from miles down the road, see a loc or a fro or some other blackness in the shadow, and scream wassup like no one else was around”
LOL. I don’t do this much cause I’ve always lived in places where there’s alot of us. But one time in Maui (not many of us there) me and mama spotted a black dude WAY down shore on the beach and starting waving our arms signal-de-plane style. Turns out it was Puffy. ha!
Also in Maui someone had written “Brooklyn in the House!” in sharpie on the bathroom style. That also made a tear well up in my eye.
@Me fail english?,
I’m sooooo glad you feel my pain. You really do feel like Tom Cruise on Cast Away.
lmao. This was soooo funny but TRUE!
DEEP SHIT MEN!
@Temite,
welcome and sh*t
I’m sure that white people would do it as well if they walked into a room full of coloreds. But that’s mostly because they’re in jail at that point and it’s going to be lights out pretty soon for them anyway.
LMBO wow!!! that was not a laugh i was prepared to laugh with my congested/hoarse/husky-voiced self. i almost choked.
anyway, interesting post Peej. tho i have lots to say on the subject, i just got back from a colored grad students conference and i… just… can’t. all the talk of race and racial inequality has made me need a rest from talking about it (which is probably why i currently don’t have much of a voice).
but you’re def on to somethin, Peej. good post.
@Gem @ the NBGSA Conference,
ooooh, how was that??! i woulda loved to go, but it just wasnt in the cards….
is about not drawing attention, though?
the feeling of being ignored and not connecting with other black people made me sad when i first started college at a predominantly 2520 university. i would get hurt/embarrassed or offended when i looked up all bright eyed with a “how are you” or “hi” and received a blank stare in response. i’ve noticed that my natural reaction now, 7 years later, is to focus my eyes on nothing in particular when walking, so that if somebody tries to speak to me in the same way i did, i wouldn’t really even see it. i never took the time to really think about it before, but it’s sad. it’s like a socialization that you go through. i think that today, we take our commonalities for granted (and i’m one of the most, “don’t get bamboozled, brothaaaaaa” type of people ever) and we’re losing the Black Experience-brother-sister kind of thing.
Food for thought, though. Because I can’t even lie, I’ve helped to perpetuate it. Every time I find myself too busy to notice the “hello” of a bright-eyed 18 year old it contributes to the cycle. So, damnit, maybe I should be more open and friendly tomorrow.
*steps off soapbox and goes to buy chips and queso*
@charli skipper,
i know i’m slow but i’ve been trying to figure out what 2520 means and I just can’t.
help.
@lulu,
its means someone whose white, something about the letters of the alphabet…
@maria,
25 = Y
20 = T
@maximillian and maria,
thanks!
@charli skipper,
So, damnit, maybe I should be more open and friendly tomorrow.
vsb.com: where the vsb’s aren’t playing when they said that they’re trying to fight crime
i did want to mention, however, that i’m like you, Peej, when it comes to speaking and connecting with other black ppl–whether or not there are 3 of us or 300 of us in an given vicinity. maybe it’s a mixtie thing?? lol idk. but i go out of my way to congregate and fellowship with other blacks, esp if we are the “minority” (like at PWIs). and i, too, get offended when other blacks don’t want to connect or speak. i don’t expect us all to think and act the same way, but i do feel like we should be able to come together on one accord of being BLACK.
idk. the half-colored in me can be very radical.
@Gem of the Ocean,
lmao@ the half colored!
i think the other side of it is the feeling of being objectified…the feeling that who i am and what im like is irrelevant, i am your focus (for the moment) simply because im black and youre black. i think a lot of black folks are ambivalent about it…
@shatani,
I am part of the ambivalent ones I think, and you captured “it” quite nicely.
i’ve attended both majority white and majority Black schools, and both have taught me a lot about identity. When I was in Atlanta at Emory, all of us (the Black students) sat at one table- it was like an unspoken code amongst us. Mind you, I had friends of all different races but at lunch time- straight to the Black table. Then when I attended Clark well, everyone of course was Black, but I noticed that there were all of these subsets of Black folks. There were the bourgeois type, the tree people, the natural folks that didn’t mess with the tree people and the folks that never left the wall…again, I mingled with all of these folks, but there was definitely separatism that existed sometimes in a not so friendly way. Fashion fridays at Spelman were a great way to witness all of these groups avoid one another and yet come together to hang out. Even outside of the HBCU environment I witness this separatism, and it seems like at least for me I witness a little more cohesive occur when we are in the minority. Which quite honestly is sad. I guess Massah won: divide and conquer. I’m just kidding…i think.
p.s.- The Low End Theory, without a doubt.
@Miss Patterson,
but, i mean, why shouldnt people gravitate towards people who share like interests just because their black? its human nature to categorize life, isnt it? white folks are separatists too. there are going to be cliques no matter where you go….
when you have a predominantly black situation like an hbcu, it seems that there is more opportunity to really bond with other black folk to are like-minded….however, if youre in a minority situation youre expected to bond with the other black people regardless of whether or not you have anything in common other than race. im not sure i think thats fair…
@shatani
I tend to agree with you in that there are cliques regardless of race. Uppity upper middle class 2520s don’t really fool with other 2520s who may live in say trailer parks.
@shatani,
I think because in this country race treads across economic/social standing. Though UMC 2520′s do not deal with trailer trash 2520′s, (in the south specifically) they will likely treat them better than an UMC Black person.
I believe that it is important that Black people (at least) acknowledge one another. No matter what walk of life we are from, it was only 50+ years ago that Black professionals were living and working among Black blue collar workers in segregation.
@BlkBond,
Though UMC 2520’s do not deal with trailer trash 2520’s, (in the south specifically) they will likely treat them better than an UMC Black person.
you know, i don’t agree with this. it seems like class has replaced race as the big divider in the country, and i’d bet that most umc whites would rather be around other umc and upper class people, regardless of their race, than trailer park whites
@BlkBond, Though UMC 2520’s do not deal with trailer trash 2520’s, (in the south specifically) they will likely treat them better than an UMC Black person.
I am white and I don’t agree with this AT ALL. I think you are waaaaaaaaaaaaay off on that one. UMC whites will usually not even make eye contact with trailor trash. I agree with The Champ that class takes presidence over race in the white community.
I have lived in TX and Seattle. It was no different either place regarding this topic.
I co-sign to the max, especially since I’m guilty. But as an African woman, we are guilty for different reasons.
The Africans I know have been socialized to believe (esp. through the institution of family) that while many Africans were taken as slaves to the Continent, we do not share a history with their descendants and that our ties to them must be at best, shallow or non-existent. This is not to say that Africans do not form deep relationships with African Americans. But according to the African immigrants I’ve interviewed for a paper I’m working on, the general consensus for their conscious or subconscious effort to avoid unity with members of their own racial group includes but isn’t limited to the following:
1. African immigrants have the highest educational attainment of any immigrant group in the United States, with higher levels of completed education than Asian Americans, but find the opposite to be true in the African American population.
2. The absence of the trickle down effect in our home countries, especially concerning wealth, supposedly allows us to better appreciate and utilize the opportunities we find in America, while African Americans have nestled themselves firmly in the luxury of convenience.*
3. African American hostility towards African immigrants
4. Differences in culture, family, marriage, etc. Many discussed rampant teenage pregnancy, high high-school drop out rates, the prevalence of gangs, single-parent families, lack of discipline/thirst for knowledge among the youth, lack of initiative, etc within the African American community.
5. Frustration at being in a country that lumps you into a category you never used to occupy (the ni***r category) and the social ramifications of that ‘forced unity.’
Basically, if my Sociology background serves me correct, subordinate members within a dominant culture often strive to maintain their unique sense of culture in order to remain relevant. In order for Africans to remain relevant, we must separate ourselves the best we can from negative stereotypes. Run that down to basic, everyday interaction and you have the African girl preferring friendships with other races over their own.
I make a conscious effort not to do this. But like Ofloveandotherdemons “the commonality of being an immigrant far outweighs every other concern, i.e. avoiding stereotypical behavior, appearing non-threatening or blending in with the status quo.” But unlike her, I don’t think Africans are worried about these stereotypes when we run into EACH OTHER because in our minds, we do not associate ourselves with these stereotypes; only when we run into African Americans.
When you grow up, like me, in a home that has a specific word for African American youth with bad behavior (akata, btw), admonitions to never be like ‘them,’ obvious parental relief at being paired with a white roommate rather than a ghetto black girl, horror at my consideration of an HBCU for an undergrad and continual reference to our differences, you tend to want to separate yourself as well in order to establish yourself as the better ‘other.’
For years my parents hated my African American best friend. She became acceptable only after she stubbornly stuck around for years, learned some of our language and absolutely adored Nigerian food. The announcement that she had a baby at 21 was tempered ONLY by my hurried addition that she was also married, still in school and graduating with two degrees and living in a house. Then my parents relaxed.
It’s ridiculous but this is what eventually leads to side-eyeing each other rather than approaching and this “recognition-lack of recognition.”
Just my 2 and a half cents. Sorry for being so verbose but stuff like this interests me deeply.
@lulu,
i think youre research is very interesting and i definitely couldve predicted the reasons you got! and i remember when my mother lost her sh*t on my aunt’s nigerian boyfriend when he referred to me as akata because i openly disagreed with some nonsense he was spouting (gasp! speaking my mind to an elder!)
@shatani,
lol. they just hate it when you don’t “respect your elders.”
@lulu,
I like to hear this perspective. Is there a difference in how African Americans are viewed in regards to which country in Africa someone may be from? My mother is African-American and my father is African so sometimes I may be naive to this. As I got older I interacted less with my father’s side of the family so maybe I missed this type of stuff.
@Humble_One,
I don’t know this for sure but I’ll go ahead and say not really, cuz my parents are from two seperate ECOWAS (west african) countries and they view AA the same, and my godmother is from Kenya (on the other side of the continent) and its the same for her.
@Dorian G.,
cuz my parents are from two seperate ECOWAS (west african)
That’s somewhat rare… isn’t it? (Mind you I am too… to a certain extent)
I gather one of your ECOWAS is Nigeria. I’m curious to know what the other one is?
@Ms. Sula,
I’ll give you three guesses, you lose you owe me a drink.
@Dorian G.,
I love charades…
. If I win, do I get a drink too?
Anyways. So I’ll go with the most obvious choices:
1. Ghana
2. Sierra Leone
3. Liberia
I hesitated between Sierra Leone and Gambia but this is my final answer.
And yes, you owe me a drink.
@Ms. Sula,
Ok Ghana I can see, but why are Sierra Leone and Liberia more obvious choices than Cote D’Ivoire, Senegal, Mali or Guniea?
@Dorian G.,
I guess I’m thinking Francophone/Anglophone dichotomy… Was the other half not Nigerian, I would have gone for either of the countries cited first…
So which is it, mister… being all mysterious and ish.
@Ms. Sula,
Yeah you’re right and I owe you a drink lol.
@Humble_One,
I don’t think there is a difference. But then again, a majority of my interaction has been with Nigerians interspersed with some Ghanaians, Sierra Leone(s) and South Africans.
@lulu
Very interesting points. I too wonder like Humble, whether many of the African countries have been socialized as such.
@V Renee,
theres socialization but theres also media portrayal…and what is put out there is that african americans are the lowest man on the totem pole for many reasons. the stuff that gets broadcast overseas isnt fair or acurate most of the time. which is why my family in ghana is under the impression that im rich, and if i come home i need to have 2 extra suitcases full of gifts for them, regardless of whehter or not ive actually met them before! i keep telling my mother, they want me to come but they not gonna be happy to see me! lol…i aint bringin shat!
@shatani,
“which is why my family in ghana is under the impression that im rich”
Haha, I got fam who still expect Mom dukes to send two big ass Christmas barrels back to them cuz they swear we’re wealthy. Apparently, owning anything with english writing on it, esp. if it’s name brand (read:Reebok, Tide, Chips Ahoy! it really doesn’t matter) means you gettin A-rab money!
*does the money shake*
@shatani,
and if i come home i need to have 2 extra suitcases full of gifts for them, regardless of whehter or not ive actually met them before!
This is the time every so called relative five times removed shows up on your door step, and being the Kenyans they are they do so un-announced. You don’t even have time to scamper off to a safe place.
The other phenomenon is how every other ‘diasporan’ that goes back home to visit tries to project an image of wealth. Seriously, fools are wearing every label imaginably at once, throwing money around like they mint it, and have on twentyfivehundred shinny, goldy things draped about their person. They constanly refer to all the cars they bought, their big mansion and cushy six figure job; in reality they are working at McDeez, live in apartment that’s one step up from a shack under a bridge and are in crazy debt. I HATE this people.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
lawdy! i never met that type…i just remember quite vividly on our last day, this one “cousin” (cuz you know everydamnbody is a cousin when free shyt is involved!) asked my mother for her shirt. i mean, the shirt she was wearing. like right then. like, we are literally walking to the car to go to the airport. the look on my face must have been something, cuz she changed her mind real quick and walked away all fast!! lol
@lulu,
Just wondering, is there a specific word for African youth with bad behavior?
@maximillian,
LMAO!
@maximillian,
Not a word,a phrase ‘soon to be deceased’. Ibilisi ( devil/devil spawn) is my mom’s favorite word for them. I can’t speak for the entire continent, but for real my mom and every other parent I knew growing up didn’t play this. Spanking isn’t illegal back home. Plus, the entire ‘it takes a village’ maxim is observed religiously. I was once canned by three seperate people, for the same offense on one day. Sigh, my poor tushie.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
“Not a word,a phrase ’soon to be deceased’. ”
Lmao! Exactly!
@ofloveandotherdemons,
That’s how it used to be here, until the State Department of Health and Children Family and Human Social Services got involved…
@lulu,
It isn’t just Africans. Jamaicans are encouraged to not be like “yankee’s” (African Americans)
When I would speak “yankee” slang at home a swift slap to the face would follow. I eventually learned that there is a time and place for everything. I speak the queen’s english in professional/school settings, slang with friends and patois at home.
@Killa Kam,
you are so right!
@lulu,
passing through to co-sign all up and through this post. I meant to do it earlier, but the home innanets is PMSing or something…
I had an epiphany the other day that my father doesn’t really have any African American friends– outside of our church friends, but he has plenty of African (specifically Ewe) friends and white friends **side eye to Daddy dearest**.
My mother has African American friends as well as friends from many other cultures, but sometimes I hear the disdain in her voice as she recounts some of their interactions and ‘typical African American’ behavior… of course, she disdains dang near errybody (I keed, I joke!)
When I was growing up they always reminded me that I was African and not African American.
What is interesting to me is that this admontion only started when we moved here from Toronto. I didn’t know I was anything other than just me until 1992. In Canada, brown folk generally identify more with their country of origin (Trini, Ghanaian, Jamaican, Bajan)… the similarity in skin color is co-incidental.
That said, outside of cultural moorings, there was no real pressure to acknowledge other brown folk when you went somewhere, more than there was to acknowledge everyone because it was the polite thing to do.
This whole “Why are all the Black kids sitting together in the cafeteria?” thing screwed with me royally because I was expected to go sit with the other Black kids, even though they wouldn’t speak to me (mainly because I was the new kid) but when I sat with the white (or Asian or Indian, etc) kids who were nice to me, I got everything from side-eyed to being called a sell out.
I still get it to this day, but now I’m grown and just don’t give a f**k. I like who I like, everything else be d@mned.
excuse my ramblings but this resonates with me. Good post Panama.
@blackberry molasses,
i feel that wholeheartedly, BBMo….i was bussed out to school from 8th grade on and coming from a black neighborhood in the city, i tried to cling to the black folks on the bus. but i soon found that they were not tryin to cling to me, and i was being treated better by the white folk at the school (well, some of them!) and since i didnt not have battered person’s syndrome, i decided that i would be around people that i liked who liked me….that shyt was revolutionary, ya’ll! they had all kinds of smack to talk behind my back, as if i gave a flying fvck!
why am i sitting at a lunch table with 23 people when i really can only tolerate 3 of them…eff that, i started my own damn table! and i know a few of the black kids at the black table who were calling me all kinds of sell outs and oreos and whatnots later went on to be none other than “the officials!” *smdh*
i talk to my friends about it to this day. i made a decision when i was 14 that i was NOT going to spend time around people whose company i did not enjoy. not ever. now, in highschool, i will admit i may have been a b!tch about it. unnecessarily rude and/or mean to people i didnt like, but ive toned it down….im not rude, but make no mistake, people know where they stand with me. it makes life a whole lot simpler.
@shatani,
“but ive toned it down….im not rude”
love..it…now i need to learn it….lol
@blackberry molasses,
This whole “Why are all the Black kids sitting together in the cafeteria?” thing screwed with me royally because I was expected to go sit with the other Black kids, even though they wouldn’t speak to me (mainly because I was the new kid) but when I sat with the white (or Asian or Indian, etc) kids who were nice to me, I got everything from side-eyed to being called a sell out.
And that is very typical of American society as a whole. People are “expected” to be one thing or another, and when they don’t follow the script, it upsets the status quo.
I think there is still such a huge hangover about the intricacy and difficulty of race relationships that these types of behavior are not ready to stop.
Case in point: I wore green today. Mainly because I love my green shoes and will use any occasion to don them, and we have a running joke in my family about us being Irish (we are not). A drunk uncle made the joke once and we ran with it (in the political and social contest of my country at the time, the joke was hilarious). I’ve been getting strange looks from both black and white colleagues… while every other person is in green… *rolleyes*
It’s about expectation. They don’t expect me to be in green so they don’t know what to make of it. How about you compliment me on my green shoes and keep it moving? Simple.
@Ms. Sula
I keep getting asked – “where is your green?”
My answer – “I’m trying to get pinched….but only by the cuties”
@Ms. Sula,
very simple! im sure i would love your pink shoes! i think the people i work with have stopped trying to place me in some box in that way. i remember when i first mentioned to a 2520 that i had actually gone on a vacation to ireland…willingly! it was like she thought amistad was back in the water and headed to europe and i was a damn passenger!
yeah, i think theyre done trying to figure out what im gonna do and say next, and im glad cuz they are usually wrong. the black folks AND the white folks…
@blackberry molasses,
never ramblings.
@lulu,
I think your perspective is moreso that of a second-generation immigrant…
Rather interesting study.
@Ms. Sula,
Actually, I’m first generation but my interviews included 1st and 2nd generation Africans who, interestingly enough held on to the same beliefs as their parents. They relaxed their standards when they became friends with AAs but constantly asserted that their particular AA friends were above those stereotypes.
Conscious effort to make friends only with AAs that weren’t ‘ghetto’ so it would be easier to defend those friendships?
Still researching…
@lulu,
Great response, very insightful in regard to a subject that has puzzled many Black people. In undergrad, I did not see this disconnect though. Many Africans were very forthcoming and friendly with us all. It was not until I began working that I noticed a little arrogance and condescending tones from some of the educated Africans. I think many do not know all of the affects of slavery and how they correlate to Black Americans today. There simply needs to be an open dialogue.
Bond. BlkBond.
@lulu,
On top of socialization, it’s also a defense mechanism of some sort. The oppressed are always the worst oppressors, and trust immigrants are under a very large thumb. AAs are handy scapegoats to vent the frustrations we encounter in this land. Also, some AAs I’ve met make it very clear that they are heads and shoulders better than us (we poor Africans). Sure other races do this but it’s harder to experience it from people who are constantly claiming affection/allegiance to a fictitious version of Africa that only exists in their mind. Case in point, the movie Coming to America; I know it’s a comedy, but that is pure asinine BS. Every time I think of that movie I want to raze something to the ground. It’s not even satirical/tongue in cheek; just pure condescending f**kery. God, I hate that movie. Add all eighty-eight versions of the God’s must be crazy to that list.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
God, I hate that movie. Add all eighty-eight versions of the God’s must be crazy to that list.
you know, up until like my 10th birthday, this was my favorite movie
@The Champ,
Mmmmmhhh,…… (giving you some serious evil eye).
@lulu,
to quote bill maher “this was some muthaf*cking articulateness!”
@The Champ,
lmao! i watched that episode the other night.
* many Africans I know are actually better off in their home countries than in America in terms of standard of living. for those degreed individuals, life becomes difficult when they are forced to repeat all or a majority of their education in America in order to continue the profession they started out with.
But of course there are those who don’t get enough of the ‘trickle’ and still come here poor and build their lives. To them, America is a land of opportunity and they wonder why AA’s haven’t taken advantage of it.
PS; it said my comment was going to be moderated. As far as I know, I didn’t use any bad words and I used astericks where needed. Hmmm…
@lulu,
Actually I got into a huge argument with one of my cousins about this, because dude was taking down “Black Americans” (i’ll spare y’all the A-word lol), like I just got to this country 2 years ago and now I’m a manager at this store, when the guy I worked with when I first got here is under me and still making excuses…etc.
My argument was simply this. The frame of reference most Naija and other Africans are working with is pure flawed data. My best friend is AA and he has actually taken trips with me to Nigeria, and the first time he went we were about 15 or so, he was taken aback by what he called the “laziness” of Africans. He just assumed all Africans were smart and hardworkers, because of what he was exposed to in the US. The argument that AA’s don’t take advantage of the “opportunities” in this country is stupid. Go to any Jack and Jill meeting and you will see nothing but pure “B”lacks that earn bread, and only associate with others like them. No africans, no west indians, straight up slave descendants.
Also the stat that “African immigrants have the highest educational attainment of any immigrant group in the United States” is misleading because again its stupid to compare the acheivements of an immigrant group to that of a native population. If any African comes over here for school, one of two things happened 1. his/her people are wealthy enough to get them here, meaning they would probably excel academically anyway because of the quality of the support system they have or 2. he/she grinded her way here, meaning they would probably excel academically because they proved to have more fortitude then the others they left behind who couldn’t make it for one way or another.
This argument actually p*sses me off because its like me getting a job at an oil company then being transferred to Warri then complaining that all the locals are unqualified and too lazy to do anything about their situation.
@Dorian G.,
The penultimate in selection bias, but it doesn’t change the fact that Africans in the U.S. socialize their children to this effect. It doesn’t make it right, but it is what it is…
That’s why its called the Continental Brain Drain.
@blackberry molasses,
penultimate is one of my favorite words! i *heart* its usage!
@shatani,
it’s one of my as well in addition to comeuppance, bucolic and penumbra.
sigh
@Dorian G.,
whats a Jack and Jill meeting?
@shatani,
Jack and Jill is a rather old social /family organization for the black bougeogie in this country. Their website states that “Jack and Jill of America, Inc is committed to ensuring that all children have the same opportunities in life…”
…and by “all children,” they really mean children who come from families with BIG dollars (preferably old) and who are politically and or buisness connected (definitely preferred.)
These folks (imho) always come off as condescending and self-important. Not to generalize, but I have yet to meet a member who was down to earth. I’m sure they’re out there, I just haven’t met them….
@ThePhiladelphiaNegro,
interesting! i never knew such an organization existed…thanks!
@shatani,
See: Our Kind Of People By Lawrence Otis Graham.
Many larger cities actually have chapters. I notice from your comments that you lived in both New Orleans and Chicago. I know member from both chapters. My undergrad was practically ‘Jack & Jill’ college.
@shatani,
oh, no, thats not me….ive lived in Boston, Philly and Rochester, NY.
“See: Our Kind Of People By Lawrence Otis Graham.”
Yeah I read this book awhile back. I was like…wow. Especially the whole part with “how to pass for white” pointers…lol
@ThePhiladelphiaNegro,
I know this girl that was in Jack and Jill, she is actually pretty cool. Then again she hated everything about her situation growing up, the balls, the debuts, the ivy expectations and the organizations that she could “only” be a part of. The weird thing is tho, she is still good friends with the other girls in her age group and said she will put her kids in Jack and Jill when they’re older. Go figure.
@ThePhiladelphiaNegro,
I don’t know which is worst Jack and Jill or Tots and Teens. The kids and parents involved in these organizations is one of the reasons I have a chip on my shoulder with black folks like this. Which is funny because I grew up around some of them but was never like them.
@Dorian G.,
“Go to any Jack and Jill meeting and you will see nothing but pure “B”lacks that earn bread, and only associate with others like them. No africans, no west indians, straight up slave descendants.”
exactly why I ain’t talked to my cousin since she started talkin bout starting up a chapter here….
long live Roc….yeah..i said it
@Dorian G.,
Ah Dorian! How I love thee.
I think you have it right. It’s mostly flawed data or ingurgitated data from whoever is in charge of distributing data.
And what I usually tell my fellow Africans is this: ” You can not bloody compare apples and oranges!!! Your frame of reference, your history, your ideas about who you are are built while growing up so you can NOT compare yourself to someone with a different frame of reference. If you want to compare yourself to someone, why aren’t you Jite Okoloko for instance? Uh? And don’t bloody bring up political ties or what not!”
Yeah, that conversation gets me heated ALL THE TIME!
@Dorian G.,
Amen. Moms is an immigrant, Daddy’s a thru and thru yankee. Granted, Daddy’s fam really aint isht (heh heh) but I never tell my closest non-yankee friends/relatives anything that goes on with the yanks because they try to high-side with all that “you guys aren’t into education”. Um, hello! You’re from a country with some of the highest murder and illiteracy rates. Of course the most enterprising individuals with the drive and ambition to fly halfway across the globe to handle their business are exceptional compared to ANYONE (including the people in your native land).
I thought if I gave it a few years and more WI’s showed up they’d quit frontin (it usually takes a little time for all the dregs and ne’er-do-wells to straggle over the border). But no, now we have predominantly immig. communities with the same problems the yank communities had and they still won’t admit the “cultural” differences arent as gaping as they claimed.
*END RANT*
@Dorian G.,
These are arguments I have confronted and recorded in my research and not my own opinions. The asterick also refers to my previous longer post and was meant to be a continuation of thought.
@lulu,
PS; it said my comment was going to be moderated. As far as I know, I didn’t use any bad words and I used astericks where needed. Hmmm…
our moderation doesnt like black people
@The Champ,
*side-eye*
I struggle with this sometimes because I think to myself that if I were in a place and a group of white people decided to come together and only acknowledge themselves I would feel that they were being discriminatory in some kind of way but at the same time I can understand why we black people do it…I think its a minority thing
*sigh*
Sometimes I feel like I can’t win for losing
@dollface,
welcome and sh*t, dollface
What I am getting from this post is that too many of us forgot where we came from. I am sure there are valid reasons for not hanging out with someone from the old days. You know, the black reasons as I call them such as:
1)Not being able to ride in the same car because the person turned into a self made dope boy
2)They swear so much that you have changed that they are the ones who changed there outlook on you
…..and there are a few others. But those are the main ones. Me personally I hang with my boys and homegirls regardless and if we have to take separate cars because of their means of raising their economic status so be it. lol
As for there not being a real concentration of young black professionals. I completely agree. I am stuck in this hole in the wall town(If you know where Penn State is you know where I am and it wouldn’t be hard to find me I stick out like a sore thumb lol *tear*). If anyone knows where I can find a place that can pay me like my current job and would have me within a decent range to see my people holla at ya boy. It seems that we young black professionals take a pilgrimage to Atlanta like its the only place for us. Hmmm maybe I should generalize that statement. We will say BP’s from the east and south.
@Double J,
meant: maybe I shouldn’t generalize that statement.
@Double J,
it feels like there is some weird conspiracy going on that is trying to get all the young professionals to move to Atlanta and buy a condo on some cul-de-sac where all the condos look alike! and i really dont feel like black people are behind it, either! lol…i just find it so odd!
@shatani,
“Young professionals to move to Atlanta and buy a condo on some cul-de-sac where all the condos look alike! ”
This is funny…because it seems to be true, lol. It’s very cookie-cutter. Now, this city is just OVER-crowded. I’ve been thinking of where I’d like to move to next…
@shatani, soooo true. i’ve been in atlanta for going on 3 years, and i’m ready for change of scenery. but now i’m starting to think that i have been taking this abundant supply of young black professionals for granted…
@shatani,
Atlanta… I know of 10,ooo people that moved there. Friend of a friend, cousin’s mother, friend’s aunt, etc. No to Atlanta. lol. What are y’all thoughts on Charlotte, Chicago, Houston, or Dallas?
@Ms. Sassy,
What are y’all thoughts on Charlotte, Chicago, Houston, or Dallas?
all good cities with decent nba teams.
@The Champ,
im into baseball…
@Ms. Sassy,
Houston IS the bomb… but people want to make it the next Atl… We don’t!
@Ms. Sula,
Please don’t…lol
@Double J, I spent 3 of the worst years of my life in grad school in “Happy Valley”- I just recently escaped and now live in Baltimore- so I feel your pain
I agree, we touched on this a little bit on my post yesterday
(** shameless plug- just call me Diddy!**)
My first year of college, I went to a predom 2520 school and the first thing I noticed was how all the black folks speak and smiled at eachother.
When I got in the professional world, the nastiest boss I ever had was a black woman, just nasty for no good reason. Was she intimidated? Did she not want to seem like she was showing me preferential treatment? Who cares, I quit anyway. lol
@Nicki Sunshine,
word! intent is immaterial. its funny, i get a lot of love from older black women in my field…like they often want to take me under their wing and be a mentor. that hasnt, however, been the case for some of my black colleagues though! they have tales like the ones about your meanazz boss.
i wonder what the difference is a lot of the time. what makes one black person feel the need to help you succeed while another does their best to break you? and then i remember…different people behave differently! its as simple as that. the fact of the matter is that most of the time when you have two different groups like white folk and black folk, there are going to be more differences within each group than there are between the two…
i dont know where i was going with that…i just went! lmao…i guess it comes down to my personal ambivalence about black unity and how it should be shown.
@shatani, “i wonder what the difference is a lot of the time. what makes one black person feel the need to help you succeed while another does their best to break you? ”
I think it has a lot to do with your age difference, your attractiveness and your education, as well as a woman’s self confidence.
A woman who is the same age, just as beautiful and smart as you, and has confidence is gonna lift up her sister… but put all of those great qualities on a woman that has no confidence???? The end result is Beelzebub in drag.
@Nicki Sunshine,
The problem is tho boo, ain’t no one the same age who is as beautiful and smart as you.
You gotta cut em a little slack ya dig?
@Dorian G.,
Who are you, Bishop Don Juan?
@nia,
In honor of St. Patty’s day I’ll rather you refer to me as Cardinal Smooth O’Perator
@nia,
Dead @ Bishop Don Juan.
@nia
LMAO @ Bishop Don Juan.
@Dorian G., Ok, dr. smooth. Although I will have to disagree, I thank u for the compliment.
@Dorian G., Ok, dr. smooth. Although I will have to disagree, I thank u for the compliment.
@shatani,
Crabs in a barrel are backwards as hell. Don’t you know that if you ish on me and I don’t make it, you just screwed yourself out of one more person who could’ve been on your team should you ever need vetting, a favor, etc. My mind always goes to how work a network.
@Me fail english?, Amen!
@Nicki Sunshine,
Who cares, I quit anyway
i’d definitely rock this to my next advisory board meeting
@The Champ, LOL!
I am guilty of this. When people approach me as friendly I take it sideways. I am trying to figure out your angle. I think part of it has to do with being from Detroit. One thing I have noticed is that I have always been more welcomed by black folks from the hood and some white folks than middle class or upper middle class blacks.
@Humble_One,
I’ve noticed that upper crust black folks seems a little more cliquish for some reason too. Don’t know why that is. Although, I’ve gotta admit I never really cared to figure out why so this may be more perception than reality,
@Me fail english?,
Same here. I don’t know. It’s not just me. I have talked to a few other friends and they have noticed the same thing. I experienced this in middle school, high school, and college.
@Humble_One,
on the whole, i feel like ive been more welcomed by white people than black people…
@Me fail english?,
The thing is upper-crust anything are segregationist. Money is the ultimate social construct anyways.
All that to say, it’s not just “upper-crust black folks” who do it but any “upper-crust” anything will act the same.
@Ms. Sula,
preach!
@Ms. Sula,
I assumed this to be the truth until I got to undergrad and was actually surrounded by real upper echelon white folks (think: the folks that own the color blue). And they still weren’t as xenophobic as their black counterparts (who ironically had only a fraction of their wealth or influence). Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure neither group was tryna put me down with their team. But one of these groups invited me out to dinners and vacations with their parents, parents tracked me down to give me internships or spent time talking to me on the phone just to check up like I was their child, etc. The other group barely said hello. You can take a guess as to which group is who, though I think my first post gives it away.
@Me fail english?,
The older the money the more “accepting” of others they are.
@Me fail english?
I went to high school with 2520′s who had stupid money…….they and their parents were always cool with my black azz.
@Humble_One,
I am guilty of this. When people approach me as friendly I take it sideways. I am trying to figure out your angle. I think part of it has to do with being from Detroit.
i do think that people from northern/cold weather cities tend to be less trusting and more cynical in general, not just blacks
@The Champ,
I was offering that theory to some folks this week-end. Warmer weather makes for warmer people… They don’t have to hurry back and get in the house. They can linger and chitchat and what not.
@The Champ,
“people from northern/cold weather cities tend to be less trusting and more cynical in general”
**Unrelated story alert**
You all know I live in Japan. So it is a very rural area and people in general leave their doors unlocked. I don’t. However my friend from Miami does. Despite the door being unlocked the Japanese will knock. So this guy knocked on the door (kind of hard) while I was at her house and I barked, “Who is it?” In English and with a whole lotta bass. She walked pass me shaking her head and opened the door. I laughed for like 15 minutes thinking, “You can take the girl out of the hood but you can’t…”
**end.sorry for the interruption**
IDK–I guess because there is so few of us here (in my city) you tend to say hello to someone you see on the street, the grocery store, at school. Especially here at the conservative financial institution. There’s only 9 of us out os 300 employees.
I remember one chick who came in acting all siddity with almost all of us and got straight frozen out. She didn’t work her long after that…lol
@miss t-lee,
“There’s only 9 of us out os 300 employees.”
Dang…I thought *I* had it bad…at 1 out of 50
@KingPine,
Yep. We’re outnumbered by the middle eastern folks round ‘chere…lol
@miss t-lee,
Hold up…can I get some Tadik!?!?!!!
@KingPine,
lol…sorry…I’m not cool with anyone like that…lol
@miss t-lee,
yo…that persian grub is down right good!
@KingPine,
I agree to the goodness of middle-eastern grub. I loves it!
@Ms. Sula,
There is a little Lebanese kiosk/restaurant that makes the best falafel pita sandwiches for less than $3. They are massive too. Guess what I’m going to have for lunch today….
Yeah!!!! VSB: Inspiring lunch ideas since 1998.
mmmmm falafel…dayum…that might be dinner…lol
Good Post.
Back in October, a co-worker (2520 of course) and I went to our former alma mater to act as representatives for a job fair. While we were there, I saw a girl that I recognized from undergrad. I do not believe we had any classes together, but we had talked before in passing. We were both in the Business school. I mentioned to him that I recognized her but couldn’t remember from where. She came up to me later and we hugged and chatted. When she left, he’s like I thought you said you didn’t really know her. I told him I don’t know her but I KNOW her. We’re both black women struggling to make today a better day than the day before. I’m like black people (for the most part) have a bond. I said, if you notice when you walk through the halls at work, ALL of the black people (except for 1 or 2) acknowledge each other. Next time you walk through the halls with me, notice that I will speak to every black person we pass and vice versa.
I still don’t think he understood.
@V Renee,
I still don’t think he understood.
he probably just needs to listen to wu-forever
Hmmmm…I guess I’m an anomaly. I went to a big white state school and all of the Black people knew each other.
@CreoleInDC,
I think that’s pretty common. Most of my black friends who went to white state schools stuck together and were active in their BSU.
@Voiceofreason,
That’s what I thought too…but this post seemed to beg to differ by saying that we went out of our way to ignore each other. That wasn’t my experience thank goodness.
@CreoleInDC,
of course all the black ppl knew each other. did they interact is the real question? i’m assuming from your experience that they did.
I attended Stanford University during my Junior year at my HBCU, and the black students there were defintiely more cohesive. However, I was turned off by this, and actively sought out interaaction with all races and ethinicities of people, much to the chargrin of those “Black at Stanford”. I was raised in a predominately black town, and attended predominately black schools, including my HBCU. And Stanford afforded me the opportunity to interact with people I would not have normally interacted with in my community, frankly b/c they are not there. I ran in a circle that included one Nigerian girl, one one Chinese girl, one Korean girl, one white girl, and my roomie who is half-Mexican/half white, plus sometimes the Jewish freshman, and the Mormon senior girl across the hall. And I loved that experience. However, I still acknowledged the black kids on campus(even though some of them woulnd’t acknowledge me b/c I didn’t spend all of my time with all of the other black students), and I still partied with them.
I think sometimes we forget that black people are not monolithic. We, African-Americans, all have a shared history and culture, but we may not all view things the same. I think one of the problems with blacks at a PWI, and one of the things that turned me off about the blacks at Stanford, was this sense of group think. That they were so monolithic that they almost seeme like this one big person with several small parts. I am grateful that at Spelman, I had the opportunity to interact with like minded individuals who share common interests, and not just b/c they were black. There are those in the AUC who were, and are now stuck up, pretentious azzholes who do not speak to other black folk, especially those whom they perceive to be outside of their “status” cirlce. Frankly, I’m glad my HBCU afforded me the opportunity to be able to avoid these people like the plague, instead of having them thrust upon me just b/c we are in the minority, and should just clique b/c of the color of our skin.
@N.I.A. fabuloussince1982….,
And I forgot, This is a great post Panama!! I <3 you for this post!!
@N.I.A. fabuloussince1982…., i’m glad you got the opportunity to study at stanford and i think you bring up a good point.
i was raised in a pretty small town and there wasn’t much diversity, outside of black/white (it was about 50-50 or darn near close to it). i chose a pwi over an hbcu for a plethora of reasons, but mainly because i wanted to be exposed to people from all different kinds of socio-economic and cultural backgrounds. when i got to said pwi, i of course embraced the afam community, but i wanted to experience more than just that. i noticed after a while that certain afams didn’t really want to associate with me, i guess because i didn’t spend all my time hanging with said crowd, and my extra-curriculars expanded beyond the black student movement…
@A Plus,
This is why I went to a PWI in the first place, but then I was mad I wasn’t around all my people. LOL It’s that since of comraderie(SP?)…
It’s probably important to also say, that I am a reserved “shy” person in general, so there wasn’t a whole lot of socializing anyway.
Good post man,
My .02…..it’s a jim crow hold over response. When you read some of laws put on black folks…free or slaved…it’s just unreal. My daily mantra is Fvck America
I’m all for unity…..but that doesn’t mean uniformity. It means unity in diversity. In fact, you can’t have unity *without* diversity.
Every time I see another brown face up here in vanilla land i shout out.
I don’t really care what white folks think. The system they use is a mess….and the more we try to emulate it….the more problems we’ll have. period.
A brother, who’s since moved to mississippi, said after dinner at my house: “thanks for having us over…..we’ve learned we can’t trust every brown face we see.”
I still hurt when I remember his the expression on his face….
@KingPine,
its a shame, but its true…sometimes brown skin folks are shady too.
@shatani,
yeah i know..them little knuckleheads from round the way…tore my car up…..badass middleschoolers….lol
all for ball point pens….wtF?!
@KingPine,
I think ya man was more caught up in the Good in a religious way. I mean the path to hades is wideswept and well travelled. None the less everybody your color ain’t your kind???
@WuDaMan,
“None the less everybody your color ain’t your kind???”
They had some hard times….served on a silver platter from other black folks…..
@KingPine,
“and the more we try to emulate it….the more problems we’ll have. period.”
i was raised on this statement…my father believes in this wholeheartedly, and i agree
@KingPine,
I’m all for unity…..but that doesn’t mean uniformity
good point
“At HBCU’s there’s no rush to speak or even notice all the Black people since we’re in such abundance; never mind that it’s a completely false representation of the real world and that it shouldn’t be taken for granted that we’re in the midst of likeminded individuals who can actually read and aren’t afraid of information at the same place at the same time.”
This is so true! I love HBCU’s, heck I wish I would have gone to one but I think you miss out on something when you are surrounded for four, five, six years by people who look like you…the “struggle” is almost the same. And it is a crying shame that we still manage to ignore our brother or sister…what if he/she wasn’t there? And you were surrounded by a mass of mo-fo’s who think the only reason you’re there is because of affirmative action or some ish. Definitely not because you’re smart!! That was the reality for me…I went to the University of Kentucky…the 2520s didn’t want “us” there and they had no problems telling you (right down to the professors…”maybe this isn’t the place for you”). AND some folk STILL played like they didn’t see you coming (unless you had on a crossing jacket and they wanted to be down…fake summama)…attempted to hang their head or play with their phone so they wouldn’t have to speak. Shame.
What ever happened to each one reach (teach) one? Clearly, we aren’t reachin’ or teachin’!
@This Just In…Welcome to SIXBURGH!,
“maybe this isn’t the place for you” followed by
old white fat boss ( think the boss from dukes of hazard) to kingpine, “what you need to do is go and dig ditches”
“fat boss” i said “that’s why I’m goin to college. So I can dig ditches if I want to dig ditches…not because I have to dig ditches”
the man tried to run me down…
@KingPine,
wow…a professor said that to you? or was it a superior at work? either way, that is effed up!
@shatani,
Boss at work….old and southern
I honestly prefer up front racists…it makes life a whole lot easier.
@KingPine,
yeah, i see your point. i would prefer that as well.
@KingPine,
Right, don’t be sneaky with it. If you’re racist, be racist. Them sneaky ones will get you every time!!
Oh and your boss should have probably been shot….that’s just where I would have gone with that. I could be wrong…
@This Just In…Welcome to SIXBURGH!,
“Oh and your boss should have probably been shot….that’s just where I would have gone with that. I could be wrong…”
It was all up in my mind….but a few glances at supermax changed my mind. So I just moved north.
@KingPine,
Definitely agree with that.
@KingPine,
Wow! That’s much worse than the time my girl’s manager called her a porch monkey. The woman had no idea what the definition of porch monkey was so she called my girl one because she over heard her saying she ate lunch on her porch.
My girl was pissed. Mainly because WE could never get away with using a term like that and get a pass because we don’t know what it means.
@Voiceofreason,
smgdh! porch monkey – did said manager get a beat down?!
Be glad she didn’t have the what I got:
1. old white boss
2. said boss is from VA
3. customized plates on his car read “Wizard”
@KingPine,
What? Wizard??? That’s too much. I don’t know how you dealt with him as a boss. My friend went off on her manager and the manager apologized because she truly didn’t know what porch monkey meant. But still! How do you reach adulthood and have no idea that you’re saying something so offensive.?
@Voiceofreason,
She knew what that ish meant…
@Voiceofreason,
members of the majority are afforded the luxury of ignorance….minority folks, not so much!
@Voiceofreason,
A. I told him to Fvck off. I don’t mind doin honest work but I ain’t nobody’s slave.
B. Told my co-workers to stop talkin to me for their own good. …
C. I’m really not good a politics…can’t you tell!?!
I mean asked too…walked over to HR…mentioned leave….saw her scurry over to boss afterwards
Sent me home in a limo…..w/ a phat check as long as I didn’t sue.
@KingPine,
Is it wrong that I want someone to tell me I should be digging ditches? Lol! It sounds like you went off in proper fashion!
@Voiceofreason,
nah, thats that black thing…like cedric the entertainer said, white folks hope and black folks wish! white people arrive like, “oh i hope no one’s in our seats,” where black people arrive like, “oh i wish a mofo WOULD be in my damn seat!”
lmao!
@Voiceofreason,
“porch monkey.”
I would have so gotten fired that day.
@miss t-lee,
reason for termination: multiple throat punches on company time.
@shatani,
*wipin a tear*
@shatani,
LOL!! throat punches would have been the least of their problems.
@Voiceofreason,
‘…porch monkey,’ this reminds me of that scene in Clerks II where Randal (the tall blonde dude) kept going on and on about how the word was not racist, and he was going to try and reclaim it for the white community. He even had his shirt stamped with the phrase at the back.
Goodness, that movie was offensive but funny as hell.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
he’s takin it back.
It’s true that blacks are the least unified ethnicity. I can only speak for myself but I was excited to be around other black people when I attended the greatest HBCU in the country. But that was because I grew up in a small, preppy, Caucasian suburb. I wanted nothing more than to get away from that place and meet people who I had things in common with. There weren’t alot of blacks at my high school and most of them fell into one of two categories: proud token or obnoxious coon, so it was difficult for me to meet people I could vibe with.
The one thing that irked me the most about my college experience (outside of some of those shady greeks who thought they were better than everyone else simply b/c they were willing to take a beat down for 2 months straight, spend ridiculous amounts of money on people they hated, compromise their integrity, or coast into an organization because of who their parents are) was the students who went to the “other” state school. A lot of them thought they were better decision makers because they chose to attend a school that was supposedly more like the real world. It was if they thought their school was better because there weren’t as many black people.
@Voiceofreason,
i feel you on that. when i visit my friends who attend morgan state uni, i am like a kid on christmas morning, wide eyed and full of excitement. surrounded by black men in college! with scholarships and 3.8+ gpas! omg, my panties are getting wet again just thinking about it.
i really wanted to go to howard for my undergrad, but my mother and aunt thought i would become too afrocentric and be in shock when i left, but really i just wanted to be more than the girl who was “smart for a black girl”
i heeded to their pressure, but now that i’m considering grad school, there are one or two hbcu’s on the top of my list.
@jana.love,
i will admit that i was and maybe still am very intimidated by the hbcu. where you felt like a kid in a candy store, i felt an odd duck. i spent a good portion of my lifetime feeling like black folks just dont like me (and it may be the phenomenon mentioned upstream regarding the relations between Africans and African Americans, which was definitely played out in my family…my dad’s AA family were convinced that my African mother thought she was better than them and was teaching me to think the same. now, granted, she IS better than them…but thats nothing to do with being African and everything to do with them being just thoroughly unsavory folk….but i digress)….so the idea of attending an hbcu a bit scary for me, honestly.
@shatani,
I’ll admit I was afraid of attending an HBCU at 1st, but I felt like it was something I needed. I had the same concerns you have. I was worried that the other students wouldn’t like me and that I would have trouble making friends. I was wrong. Trust me, you’ll meet people alot like you and you’ll make plenty of friends depending on the HBCU you choose. Alot of people go to HBCUs for the same reasons and have a tendency to gravitate to each other. Of course you’ll meet people that won’t like you, but chances are you won’t like them either, so it won’t matter. Lol!
@shatani,
well i myself am not AA. i am from the caribbean, born and bred. sometimes i don’t feel connected to the black kids at school, sometimes i don’t feel like they understand me because we have the same skin, different culture. but i felt (and i feel this way when i meet new ppl in bmore). that we have the same underlying goal, gettin that educmacation!
my best friend is AA and sometimes her mom thinks that i am uppity, but i explain to her why i agree/disagree, or do/don’t do something. she quiets down after that.
i still feel more comfortable around blk ppl in a college setting than 2520′s. maybe its because 2520′s are so frickin intimidated by me. it makes ME uncomfortable, to see their uncomfort!
@jana.love,
The first time I learned of the differences between AAs and Caribbean born blacks was when I went to law school in NY. There were very few AAs and alot of the Caribbean students seemed as though they thought less of AAs. Friends who assumed I was from Jamaica or Trinidad (because of my hair)would say things to me like, “Wow. You’re American? You don’t act like it.” I guess that was supposed to be a compliment but I was slightly offended.
@Voiceofreason,
“obnoxious coon”
this is a great and terrible insult. i’m definitely gonna try to use it this week
during my first week at school, i hold my breath to see the colored folks in my class. this semester i was astounded at the 3-5 black kids in my major classes! 3-5!! omg!
i attend a big school in a small state that kicks ass at bball most years (holla @ thabeet). but we aren’t known for blk ppl. thankfully, i always smile and say hi to my fellow blk classmates in the hall way. hell, last semester one girl just took my name and number cuz we were the only 2 blk girls! we never sat next to each other, but best believe we studied and helped each other out.
these things do not occur in an event i attend though, especially if i was working and they were attending, when i worked for a small non profit, we held a crapload of events, and i would either be walking around making sure everything was okay or manning a table of some sort, the blk folks would never make it to my table!! and i thought it was a damn shame!!
@jana.love,
eh. uconn deez.
Ironically (or not) Q-Tip does ask-on The Low End Theory-what’s a black nation without black unity?
But, dealing with the subject at hand, at the directional school I went to, there were a few hundred of us, but we all knew each other and we all spoke as we passed by. Class was not a big factor, because most of us came from similar backgrounds.
Fast forward to the big white school in the south. The school community was five times bigger than the one at the directional school, but the class system was in full effect. Black students separated themselves in all sorts of non-creative ways and were notorious for getting into fights with the black townies as well. Of course, when it was time to pose in front of a historic (for us) building, in February, it was all, brother/sister, can u spare a donation…
It carried over to the work world as well, all in an effort for some to prove that they are not one of “those” negroes, when, in fact, if you’re not Jordan, Oprah, Barack or Tiger, you’re still a suspect, still a credit risk, still a threat…
@maximillian,
The school community was five times bigger than the one at the directional school, but the class system was in full effect.
in your opinion, what caused the change?
@The Champ,
The community was more diversified, so the relative shared experience that was a bonding point at the directional school was basically non-existent. Athletes were on another planet, as were the black engineers and law students. Greeks lived in a different solar system. The gospel choir and their groupies held a lot of sway. Then there were those whose behavior was extra because of the very name of the school, etc etc…
Now, in law school, it was a completely different thing. There weren’t nearly as many people, and my class had the largest group of black students in a while. And we used to sit together in our law school cafe, and would often times hang out together outside of school. However, I am a person who pays attention to character, and by the end of my first year, I knew I wouldn’t be friends or even associates with half of those black people in my class if I had met them in the AUC, and we weren’t a bunch of minorites at a big state law school in Ohio. And that experience taught me the most about unity, and how not all of us want to be a part of a unified black front. He11, in law school, BLSA (shared with the other minority groups) had its own lounge, and there were people during my last year of law school who would not dare come into the lounge, or even interact with BLSA unless they could get something out of it like a study aid or something. Those people can kick rocks….
@N.I.A. fabuloussince1982….,
It was the same way with BLSA at my law school. There were some die hard members, but most of the black students didn’t want to be associated with it. It’s as if they felt it was unprofessional to call attention to their blackness.
@Voiceofreason,
We had some who were active in BLSA who would not dare put BLSA on their resume, even if they had organized an event or something. It’s funny, b/c I think they think if they pretend to detest blackness or things associated with being black, then some how 2520 won’t see them as black. Which, to me, is incredibly problematic for their psyche….
@N.I.A. fabuloussince1982….,
i dont think its about somehow not being seen as black…but about seeming less threatening to the 2520s. being an active member or even an organizer for an organization that has black in its name is often seen as a sign of “uppity” to them…and then they get to their cost/benefit analysis – is this a militant black? probably. they’ll be in HR every other day! they are so sensitive! i cant afford a lawsuit. what if jim says something, like he always does. he’s funny, but he really shouldnt say that stuff in mixed company. i really cant afford a lawsuit! better go with the one who was in the glee club at the PWI, just to be on the safe side!
disclaimer: the above was a dramatization based on things ive heard from 2520s and things ive seen in the workplace (you get an interesting perspective when youre in a place as an intern) and in no way means that this is the thought process of ALL white folk. thank you and good day.
@shatani,
Thank you shatani for that dramatization….
When I said “won’t see them as black”, that’s kinda what I meant. Basically, they won’t see them as a threat to their social order.
Most Blacks have been mind-fucked into thinking Black unity is bad since so many of us feel we’ve been victims of white unity. It was evident at how many weak minded idiots (yeah I said it) immediately followed their proclamation of support for Obama with, “And it’s not cus he’s Black.” WTF-ever. I was walking the streets of DC, Bethesda, and Herndon telling white folks I was supporting Obama and hoping they would ask me why. I was fully prepared to say, “Cus he’s Black/nigra/dark/etc.” Then blink and walk away. I never got my chance. Apparently I didn’t have my approachable, friendly face on. LOL
I’m also the person who shamelessly looks for Black doctors and dentists. If I can’t find Blacks, I go for women. I lucked up and found a Black woman. Funny that nobody says shyt about me, or Jews, for doing that. Yet, leaning towards a candidate because he’s Black should be cause for shame and unsolicited defense. BTW, did anyone question the women who were supporting Hil. C.?
I was actually going to write about this. I think we, as a community, are so messed up from the games we think whites have played on us, we aren’t willing to play those same games for our own benefit. Take nepotism in the work place. I’ll be the first to say when I go through resumes, lemme find one with a HBCU on it or a BGLO. Their asses are getting an interview. Hell, I’ve called up my fellow Blacks and told them they have typos on their resumes. Yet, I hear so many Blacks in hiring positions who don’t do this for other Blacks.
@Hostess, I see why my comment wasn’t accepted but I couldn’t change it. *shaking fist at the censorship Gods!*
@Hostess,
I am so curious about what you said. PLEASE rephrase it!!! I’m nosey.
@Hostess,
I’m also the person who shamelessly looks for Black doctors and dentists. If I can’t find Blacks, I go for women.
And for the goodness of your health you should! There are conditions like Sickle-cell that are specific to black people.
At least, I do it shamelessly. I want somebody who understands what I might going through!
p.s: I was fooled once though… lol! This lady with a very African sounding last name… turns out she was white, and had an African husband.
@Hostess, I’m also the person who shamelessly looks for Black doctors and dentists. If I can’t find Blacks, I go for women. I lucked up and found a Black woman.
I am the same way. I am still looking for a black and /or female doc in Raleigh…so all of you Raleigh/Durham folk, holla at ya girl.
Also, I think I mentioned on the gretchen post that I have a preference for HBCU folk, and I always pass on info about jobs, grants/fellowhips/scholarships, and other opportunities to all of my black friends, especially my HBCU family. It is unfortunate that we don’t support each other, or try to pull each other up the way 2520s do. We don’t look out for our own….
@Hostess,
“I’m also the person who shamelessly looks for Black doctors and dentists. If I can’t find Blacks, I go for women. I lucked up and found a Black woman.”
I do this, too. Mainly because I overheard a black girl say that she and her mom wouldn’t allow a black owned contractor to work on their house because they felt like the black contractor wouldn’t do a decent job. It made me wince because I often wondered how many black people felt this way.
Interesting post that I have often wondered about myself..
I don’t know why this is. I attended a PWI (Roll Tide!). Loved it! It’s a state school, so a lot of the kids knew each other. I didn’t know a soul! I got involved on campus. Most of the time I was the only black person. Initially, I got irritated about the constant overaccommodating that white people do when you are the only black person. Like trying to relate to me somehow through false generalizations. The black people on campus kinda viewed me as a “sell-out” because I was hardly ever around black people.
@Reci,
I noticed that when I went to a PWI for law school. The black students that didn’t hang out with a bunch of other blacks were always called sell outs. I’d ask if they ever stopped to think that they’re hanging out with a clique of white people because those are the people they just so happened to befriend when they came to school. Regardless of ethnicity, when you make a good group of friends you stick with them.
@Voiceofreason,
can i get an amen on this?!?! good folks is good folks and that transcends race/ethnicity/religion/political affiliation/etc, in my book.
@shatani,
Amen!
@Voiceofreason,
I totally agree.
It’s sad. For some black people, I’ll always be the black girl that “acts white”.
Speak on it, Panama.
This ish is that “divide and conquer” mentality that’s been so ingrained in our heads. And the whole “afraid to unite” thing is one of those factors. 2520s help each other out and it’s simply that: helping. Black folks do it; it’s called “affirmative action” and thus deemed controversial.
It seems we’re the only effing race that has some sort of stigma attached to helpin’ a brotha/sista out.
@Cheekie,
you like quotations alot, huh?
@The Champ,
lol. I do “that” “too”
@The Champ,
“you like quotations alot, huh?” << (using quote marks here is completely justified)
Yeah, we go way back. I don’t do air quotes too often, though. We just associate with each other on the internets.
I like parenthesis (see above; and this right here too), too. We’re dating.
Very Insightful post. My comments have been made where I see fit. On a lighter note…Midnight Mauraders is that crack. It seems to always be those 2 guys who started listening to jazz who try to tell you why Low End Theory is better; as if I don’t have any coltrane, monk, davis, etc. in my music collection.
I understand that Black people are not monolithic, however, I challenge any Black person to try this argument in the face of adversity (i.e. the police).
@BlkBond,
I can’t see how anyone could think the Low End Theory is better than Midnight Marauders. It seems to me there’s really no argument.
@Voiceofreason,
Ok, let me break this tie up and speak for People’s instinctive travels and the paths of rythm.
My absolute favorite. I mean, I left my wallet in El Segundo? Classic.
@BlkBond,
i was gonna mention this upthread, but i feel left out in certain discussions that educated late 28-38 year old blacks have because i never was into the tribe. i guess i understand why they’re popular, but, i dont know, i could never get past q-tip’s voice
sorry i had to get all lupe fiasco and sh*t, but i needed to get that off my chest
@The Champ,
bwuahahaha sadrite The Champ. LOL.
@The Champ,
I liked Tribe but once a LET vs. MM debate comes up (this is not the first one I’ve been a party to) I notice a sharp distinction between ppl who listened to Tribe and Tribe-heads. Tribe-head, I am not.
Maybe cuz I was like 6 when LET dropped. I was more of a Hammer chick myself. (I danced at BBQs all summer to “Can’t Touch This”):) That said, MM hands down.
Bullseye…….Panama.
I have seen numerous Tech/Trade/Business Conventions come to town. (Las Vegas) ….I sit at my desk in the lobby in a Suit & Tie……and watch the Thousands of people who are supposed to be the movers & shakers of society…and the Black folks are non-existent. (Unless it’s the Clothing Convention or Photography Expo…Sorry but true) / When they are here they walk past my desk 4-5 times walking in circles…they’d rather ask the janitor or housekeeper for directions or info…than ask the Brother in a suit behing the huge “CONCIERGE” sign on his desk. / I never notice this “phenomenon” with the international clientele but some of our folks should know better. / It was depressing to see the conventions come to town and be at the forefront of the “Next-Big-Thing” and not see any of “US” around……What’s unique is that you can always tell the look…..the opening day of the convention…..It’s that WHERE ARE WE LOOK???
@Black Concierge,
i think you’re the first vsb-er who has their occupation as their vsb handle. maybe there should be some type of prize or something for this.
I haven’t read any of the comments yet but me and my fam was just talking about this. Except in reverse. We was talking about how our friends of other races (not just palefaces) were in awe and notice how when we would see another black person we would say hello and talk like we knew them. Even though we never saw them before and likely will never see them again. But then I realized as I traveled from mideast (DCurrrea) to bible belt (south) and back up north (NYC area) that this seems like 1) a southern phenomenon 2) a non EBP phenomenon and 3) distinctly US-born phenomenon. (I like that word) I definitely have experienced the “don’t want to act like I see you so white people don’t think we all know each other and thus do or say something that makes me want to kill them cuz I know I’mma need their references for a job when I get out of here” ignore. It was one of the reasons I hated going to a ‘white’ club with friends (just one) and seeing a good-looking black man there b.c. no matter what was going on, how much attention I would get, I would be completely invisible to him. (of course this is twice as dumb b.c. if a brotha goes fishing in a pond full of whiting that’s obviously what he’s looking for). However strange every black girl I saw in the club, it was like we knew each other. We would all give up the eyeroll when the techno and the glowsticks came out. It was disappointing until me and my girl (and other random black girl dragged to the club) decided it was fun to try and roll up on the sole black men just to see them break they necks trying to avoid us. Redonkulus BTW- really fun game to do in the club if you aren’t enjoying it and there’s another miserable sister in the room. Get creative.
Anyway, final statement is that its been my experience that Panama’s phenomenon normally happens to me when other EBPs. I’m just saying when I run around with or without my little white coat on I say hi to everyone (especially little old ladies. Always say hi to little old ladies and help them up stairs and sh!t cuz if you don’t the get mad vengeful and call curses down on you and do s#*& like stand right in the way of hallways and stairs blocking it up, take extra time getting on elevators to go to the 2nd floor, holding up lines at cash registers, messing up traffic. Don’t know how they do it but the do it on purpose. I suspect they drop their purses and packages on purpose where it will be most inconsistent and they definitely hit you with their canes and walkers and stuff just for the attention) and the only ones who don’t respond are the comatose and the others in white coats(which actually isn’t isolated to black folk but that’s another subject).
@willnotbetelevised,
the whole “black person in the white club” thing is an entirely different animal…and a possible potential vsb entry.
btw, for whatever reason, up until this comment, i assumed that you were a guy.
@willnotbetelevised,
You sound like your a lot of fun in da club. I helps them old ladies. They can be fun and funny sometimes. Then again that’s old people period. The was young once too you know.
Aight I know unity when most people don’t. You got to understand the Wu’s Story. See I grew up on the wrong side GI crimeside where staying alive was no jive. My home city which was jim crow before the civil rights movement/riots and became a chocolate city thereafter. So going to college @ an hbcu should have been just like an extention of hs right?
WRONG.
The cultural diffs I experienced were something else. But I still knew how to use soap and deoderant so I made friends. All it takes is showing yourself friendly. Smile. Offer to open a door. Share your gifts/expertise. You got to have some love to get some love.
@WuDaMan,
Oh and the engineering school was combined great big 40,000 student 2520 state school combined w/ lil ole 16,000 student knegra school. I found out while commuting via train that the semester before I got there there was a sit in over preferential treatment. Sad thing is Racism is a global issue. But back to my story. One day I look up @ the seating arrangements in the class. There was one aisle in the class up the middle. It looked like a yin yang symbol only one 2520 on the right and only one knegruh on the left. hm. & @ this 2520 state school. I heard that all the kneegruhs knew each other.
& dudes was like you had to have your A Stuntin game on to go holler @ chicks on the lil campus. But you could pull some cave man game across town in 2520 state funded matriculteville.
@WuDaMan,
I don’t know about yall but I like Dave Chapelle’s version of real world. I vote next real world happens in D.C., Flint, East St Louis, Gary Indiana. Or somewhere like that.
@WuDaMan,
WOOOOW @ East St. Louis & Gary. The crew would have to wear vests and choose a ‘nation’ to represent. That would not be a PG T.V. friendly show..
@WuDaMan, Damn. I might have to FB friend you for this comment!!!! I would so love if they did Real World in the D. Like, it would make my day! I would TiVo and host viewing parties.
@Hostess,
Ain’t really been nobody hood on there since Heather B. Maaaybe Coral. But she flip flopped with the 2520′s, so she’s iffy.
@nia,
I loved Heather B. She got down.
@Hostess,
It’s so cold in the D!
I think this the link to the video for anyone who hasn’t seen it. I can’t confirm because youtube is blocked at my job.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aktLRiWXfqg
@WuDaMan,
You know one time I was hanging out w/ a new prof in the hallway. It was the beginning of a semester so everybody is crying and devistated after visiting the finanacial aid office. Where people are turned into sehx slaves do boys and artaficial hit men in one two minute visit. If not that they were brought to their knees in a primal scream in 2.25 minutes. People lined up outside that building like Jesus was going to hook em up or something or concert tickets or whatever people line up for.
Well this new prof. who just looked like one of the career students that attended the University. So I start choppin it up w/ him. Yapping about getting overrides into classes cuz I couldn’t registre w/ some arbitrary hold on my this that the what evuh. Unbeknownst to me he was a HBCU grad. You know what he had to say about why people go to a HBCU. He said, ‘it’s to teach you how to deal w/ some of the worst shyt evuh and come out smilin and shinin on the other side.’
@WuDaMan,
You know what he had to say about why people go to a HBCU. He said, ‘it’s to teach you how to deal w/ some of the worst shyt evuh and come out smilin and shinin on the other side.’
This is partially true. It’s not the sole reason for going to an HBCU but I went through some hellish times at my HBCU and it made me a better woman. If I had gone to another school that caused less stress (like the “other” state school that shall not be named but rhymes with Orida Ate. Lol.) I don’t think I could’ve handled the obstacles I faced after I graduated college.
@WuDaMan
I don’t think I’ve seen a comment where someone responded to themselves as many times as you have with this one.
Good job.
@V Renee,
*takes a bow*
I’m an originator & long winded.
@WuDaMan,
But I still knew how to use soap and deoderant so I made friends
Why must you kill me?
preach man preach! (and other things shouted during a church service)
I’ve experienced both mostly black public schools and private schools that were less than 5% black. moral of the story: “I LOVE BLACK PEOPLE!”
I feel like we often take the visible commonality of color for granted until we notice that in a room of 100 there is only you, or you and that guy that looks black on the other side of the room.
transitioning from a virtually all white school to an HBCU I find myself FRUSTRATED with my peers-the ones who take our community for granted.
If the strength we had in numbers is what brought us so far, is the relative separation of our race what is keeping us stagnant?
Working in EMS in the Philadelphia area for a number of years now, I’ve always noticed that there was a shortage of black rescue medics outside of the medics who actually work for PFD.
I work in Chester, a 99.999% black city outside of Philly w/a department that only had 3 other black men when I started. (My hiring made four: one for each four platoon.)
When I first arrived there, I was often incensed at the way some of my White co-workers spoke about the citizens of Chester (i.e. “People in this town are lazy fcuks” or “what did you expect…he/she is from Chester”) and I took them to task on it WHENEVER the appropriate chance arose.
What REALLY messed me up is when I started there and met one of the other black medics from a different platoon who was from around my way back in Philly and during a night shift together, this dude proceeds to regurgitate the same racially insensitive crap that I heard a lot of the other medics spewing.
I
@ThePhiladelphiaNegro,
This makes me think of something my boy used to say…
Whenever he’d tell people he was studying to be an actuary or I’d tell people I was going to law school we’d always get a response like, “Good, we need more black _________.”
My boy would always ask why people bother saying that. “Don’t we need more black everything other than rappers, athletes, musicians, drug dealers, pimps, prostitutes, and strippers?” For some reason I never thought about things that way until he made that comment.
@Voiceofreason,
Whenever he’d tell people he was studying to be an actuary
Completely off topic… Does your boy accept mentees? I have a sister who wants to go into the field… and wants to know more about it first hand… The only other actuary I know has sworn not to talk to me anymore (why must exes be so bitter?
)… Please let me know… mssula79@gmail.com
(I’ll even take pointers/websites and the likes if he has them).
Thanks a bunch!
i’ve been at a conference this week where everywhere i go, its a room of white people. and yes I feel uncomfortable. then when me and my posse of 20 black folks roll together (to another session, to lunch, to a bar) i feel like we are a gang. it’s weird.
@The Champ
Yeaa more Jill Scott than Gil Scot
Black people in a white club is a different beast but has the best stories/games.
@WuDaMan
Gotta find some way to entertain yourself. I also laugh at white people dancing. And try to tell if they’re drunk, epileptic or just bad.
My favorite NYC subway game is where’s the rat. Extra points for babies, rats fighting, rats found on the platform, rats with missing or extra parts, rat copulation, or rats in humorous situation (like dragging an item bigger than himself or talking or something). Triple bonus for any ratVpigeon actions.
@ThePhiladelphiaNegro
Yo those random congratulations for attempting graduate studies is what keeps me trying to continue in school. Side note: a man was outside the mall trying to sign people up to go to school. I was walking by with my girl and ol’ boy straight up ignores me and yells at my girl “you need to go back to school” like she was a delinquent. When she said she was in school he didn’t believe her and grilled her all about her masters program. Didn’t say shit to me. I got my comeuppance (another word that should be used more like mendacity and misanthrope) for making fun of her looking like a high school truant. Same outing got accosted by a pimp trying to recriut me and straight ignored my girl. Guaranteed my girl always looks like she got a knife on her and knows how to use it. Even in proffesional work clothes