as you all probably know by now, i’m the sh*t.
don’t be mad at me, though. i can’t help it, and even if i could, i probably wouldn’t. it seems like it’d be too time-consuming
still, while being the sh*t has its obvious perks and bonuses (ie: free chicken from starbucks and the inherent ability to switch stations back the exact moment the commercial is over), i’m actually a bit over my sh*ttyness now because apparently everyone else thinks they’re the sh*t too. bummer
between our blogs, twitters, facebook accounts, smart phones, ironic pseudonyms, unironic tattoos, concentrated tastes, and highly specialized professional skill-sets, we have enough collective self-importance to fill aretha’s bras.
while extensive ego-stroking is undoubtedly fun and surprisingly practical (i’ve become quite adept at one-handed typing), hannah seligson’s “do narcissists have better sex” presents evidence that this me-me-me mindset is ruining relationships:
The most recent research on narcissism runs contrary to what the legions of self-help experts have proselytized when it comes to finding love—that you have to love yourself before you can love someone else. (jean) Twenge says that’s a fallacy. “There is no evidence that people with very high self-esteem are any better in a relationship than people with low self-esteem.”
In fact, narcissism, even in small doses, has shifted courtship into a high-stakes relationship culture. Now that people think more highly of themselves, expectations of what a relationship should be like have skyrocketed into the realm of superlatives. Twentysomethings not only expect to waltz into high-level career positions right out of college, they also expect partners who have the moral fortitude of Nelson Mandela, the comedic timing of Stephen Colbert, the abs of Hugh Jackman, and the hair of Patrick Dempsey.
“Everyone is looking for ‘the perfect product,’” says Perel, who says she believes this is creating not just emotional, but also sexual, frustration. “People are not willing to compromise, or willing to be patient.”
while i definitely agree that too much self-regard ruins romance (“cockiness” and “the ability to compromise” mix like black and bleach
) i can’t help but think that this pandemic hyper-haughtiness is just an evolved form of self-preservation.
i think that we’ve seen so many blah relationships and broken families that we’ve collectively lost confidence in each other, transforming “do you“ from an highly egocentric mantra to an imperative must.
vaingloriousness is somewhat justified if you honestly (and rightly) feel helplessly vulnerable without it.
people of vsb.com, what do you think?
is this selfishness self-sabotaging ourselves, or is this conceitedness crucial to surviving now? (or both?) the carpet’s yours and sh*t.
now, please excuse me while i continue getting over my own sh*ttyness. don’t wait up. this might take a while.
—the champ
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{ 267 comments… read them below or add one }
the carpet’s yours and sh*t.
*hoping for an airbed tomorrow*
@overit, “they also expect partners who have the moral fortitude of Nelson Mandela, the comedic timing of Stephen Colbert, the abs of Hugh Jackman, and the hair of Patrick Dempsey.”
they mean the hair of jay-z, THAT would be ideal, lol.
when i read pandemic i heard “pandemic!’ (The Wire) in my head.
The selfishness and the ego stroking pop culture promotes is def self sabotaging, life does not work that way and just like drugs, its a quick fix you WILL crash from eventually. What then? Its damaging to relationships at home to work..in short, its damaging. And I’m OVERIT!
nighty night midnight crew:)
@overit,
“when i read pandemic i heard “pandemic!’ (The Wire) in my head.”
LOL.
@overit,
when i read pandemic i heard “pandemic!’ (The Wire) in my head.
one vsb-er whose name i won’t reveal told me she thought someone was outside of her door screaming “pandemic” until she realized it was coming from the tv.
needless to say, some very smart sistas are less smart than others
@The Champ, needless to say, some very smart sistas are less smart than others
iDied. u know u ain’t right Champ.
@overit, they mean the hair of jay-z, THAT would be ideal, lol.
is this jay before or after the Great Post D.O.A. Haircut of 2009?
@Panama Jackson, before of course! lmao.
btw, what’s poppin on U st. this weekend?
@overit, or at least a blanket and a pillow…….
@JamaicanGirl, you know? people are just out here rude and unapologetic.
Nope. If I dont love me, then who will? You wont love me like I want you to. So…
Aint nothin wrong with a lil selfishness. It just cant take over the entire relationship, otherwise Im out. You gotta believe in yourself first and foremost or I dont even cast you a side-glance.
All things in moderation I guess…
@Miss Sia,
I agree the moderation part is important . If you are only about self how do expect a marriage or shacking relationship to survive? It will implode faster than a unicorn can leap over a dream… lol… At the end of the day it is about balance. time & place…
@Naturally Alise,
yay!! the unicorns are back!! where are the leprechauns, centaurs and albino midgets?
@blackberry molasses,
where are the leprechauns, centaurs and albino midgets?
look under your bed
@Miss Sia,
Not being rude, but to love oneself is almost an oxymoron. To love means to give. To give to oneself, means to be selfish. lol.
Sure, there are other aspects of love such as temperament and what not. But that whole loving yourself thing is maybe the most narcissistic of them all. Maybe you shouldn’t allow yourself to be treated poorly, and you should do thing to keep yourself together … but love means to give. IDK, just my thoughts.
@thismayconcernyou,
“To love means to give.”
Says who? For you, maybe. For others, not so much.
The way I see it, most love comes from a self-interested (I guess “selfish” is the word VSB wants to use today- fine with me, though the connotation sounds negative) place so I really don’t see what’s so oxymoronic about loving oneself.
@Me fail english?,
Agreed.
To love does not ONLY mean to give. When we love, we tend to give but that is not the sole purpose or definition of love.
And why not give to oneself? To give time, hope, support, compassion, fun to oneself is absolutely not oxymoronic… at least in my book.
@Me fail english?,
I think y’all are missing my point. I understand that there are other aspects of love … like I said. But the first and most important aspect of love is to give. People try to have their own definitions … But if you’re a Christian, then the definition put before you is there …
“For God so loved the world that ‘he gave.’”
Like I said, there are many other aspects … the things that you give: patience, temperance, no hate, etc. … but the definition is there. Giving is where it starts.
And giving to yourself, isn’t the answer.
@thismayconcernyou,
“But if you’re a Christian, then the definition put before you is there …”
I am Christian. And that’s TOTALLY not the way I interpret that passage. But I won’t get into that there. I’ll only say that the verse you cited is NOT a definition so much as it’s a display/demonstration of love. We all have different definitions, so no need for me to cite Psalms.
I’ve given time, support, compassion, etc to people that I did NOT love. That’s the type of person I am. And I LOVE that about myself
I think a better question would be how do you define “oxymoron”, because if I’m not mistaken, there’s nothing oxymoronic or even ironic about “self love” or even “selfish love”.
@Me fail english?,
we are so —><— today.
are you inside my brain?
vacate the premises or start payin rent!!!!
@Me fail english?,
You’re definitely free to believe what you want. And I’m definitely no genius nor omniscient … but I’m almost certain that most every pastor/bishop you cross would tell you that the definition of love starts with giving.
IDK. Maybe it’s just semantics, but I’ve grown to laugh at the idea of “loving yourself” because it’s “selfish.” I get it, though.
No biggie, though. Good discussion.
@blackberry molasses,
Yeah, me fail is a serial brain invader. She was moonwalking on my cerebellum yesterday.
Oh, and also, co-sign, me fail!
@blackberry molasses,
Rent?! In this recession? Pshaw!
*erects entire shantytown on BBMo’s cerebrum*
@Me fail english?,
im baptist
@Me fail english?, you have been on point a lot lately:)
@Me fail english?,
aight, that’s the way you wanna play? i’m cutting the electric, water and gas.
*grumbles* she ain’t gon’ have fiddy-leven people livin all up in MY cerebrum that ain’t paying fo shyt.
@thismayconcernyou
Your definition of love sounds more like sacrifice, which probably makes you an incredibly kind person, but isn’t how many view love. I think love also includes listening, accepting, supporting, etc. and you can and should do all those things with yourself too.
@thismayconcernyou,
“Not being rude, but to love oneself is almost an oxymoron. To love means to give. To give to oneself, means to be selfish. lol. ”
I think to give ONLY to oneself is selfish. Everyone gives things to themselves so if your definition is correct, then everyone is selfish which means it shouldn’t really have the negative connotation we give it.
Everyone should nourish themselves and love themselves because it’s probably the greatest love of all.
@Cheekie,
“Everyone should nourish themselves and love themselves because it’s probably the greatest love of all.”
That’s scary language. IMHO, The greatest love of all is to die for someone else.
@thismayconcernyou,
But that’s an action, not a feeling. I’m saying the act of loving yourself is probably the greatest because it takes the most work. You have to live with YOURSELF for the rest of your life…no one else can claim that, but you.
@Cheekie,
I agree. I think “thismay”‘s post makes it sound like you have to self-love to the exclusion of others. Not true. In fact, downthread you’ll find folks recalling how learning to love themselves only served to enhance their ability to love outwardly. I count myself among those people.
Self-love shouldn’t be confused with narcissism. They’re very different things.
@Me fail english?,
“Self-love shouldn’t be confused with narcissism. They’re very different things.”
Yep.
@Me fail english?,
“Self-love shouldn’t be confused with narcissism. They’re very different things.”
Exactly. Love is infinite. Limitless. If you can love more than one person, why can’t you be included in that amount?
@Me fail english?,
Self-love shouldn’t be confused with narcissism. They’re very different things.
in your opinion, whats the difference?
@The Champ,
I am not Me Fail, but here is some insight:
self-love (slflv)
n.
The instinct or desire to promote one’s own well-being; regard for or love of one’s self.
nar.cis.sism
n.
n.
Excessive love or admiration of oneself. See synonyms at conceit.
@The Champ,
IMO, a narcissist’s love for himself limits his or her ability to love others with the same fervor. His love is reserved for himself. On the other hand a person can be just as enamored with herself as the narcissist is with himself, but if she is able to see appreciate and love others strongly too, I wouldn’t call her a narcissist.
I think it’s a “I know it when I see it” type of thing.
@Me fail english?,
Maybe I’ll just write something to explain my thoughts … I definitely don’t think there’s something wrong with upkeep of self. And maybe it’s just semantics.
One of the main things The Good Book tells you to do is to find yourself through self-reflection … but when you do, what are you supposed to do? Give. Like I said, maybe it’s just semantics because it sounds familiar to what others have said.
But I just think love isn’t about you, but rather what you do for others. how you react or don’t react to their actions. Avoiding hate, jealousy and spite.
anyway, good discussion.
@thismayconcernyou,
“But I just think love isn’t about you, but rather what you do for others. ”
Interesting take. I honestly don’t wanna live in a world where love is this limited. Like I said above, love is infinite and can be distributed every which way. It’s the reason why I believe in the “love yourself to love someone else” mantra. By allowing yourself to be loved by someone else, you are essentially loving yourself by expressing you are worth said love. And loving someone else, is in a sense, sharing the love you have for yourself.
@cheekie,
I don’t think love is limitless … but you have to understand what that means, too.
Remember, “the love of money is the root of all evil.”
You can love the wrong things, which can be a #massivefail. smh. Life is tough. lol.
@thismayconcernyou,
True, you can love the wrong things. But how can “yourself” be a wrong thing is what I wanna know. If you feel you’re not worthy of your own love, how are you worthy of someone else’s?
@thismayconcernyou,
Interesting perspective. I don’t know what it means to “find one’s self” cause I never did it. I think people who love themselves ultimately share with and give to others. That doesn’t make their behavior oxymoronic though, imo.
I just wonder how can you define love as “giving to others” in one instance and then make reference to “the love of money” as a root of evil.
What does love of money have to do with “giving”? And how can “giving” ever be a root of evil? I may be taking this too literally. It may also be because I don’t think people literally “love” money, so I don’t see how it relates to Cheekie’s post.
@thismayconcernyou,
Love is limitless. Not the love of, but Love.
I think we are making a few amalgams here. Saying Love is limitless means love is not a fixed and set amount. There is a not a bowl of love everybody is given that needs to be assigned in a certain way or manner. Love is limitless in the sense that having love for myself in no way, shape or form prevents me from loving other people/things/places/sensations…etc.
It doesn’t end… I tend to believe that people who can only give to others have not really understood what Love and its limitless power is. Giving to others does not in any way, shape or form prevent you from giving to yourself or vice versa.
Like Cheekie said, I would be very dismayed to live in a world where the only love that could be given/received was to/from others. What a sad, sad world it would turn out to be.
@ me fail,
I’ll admit it, you got me there. “the love of money is the root of all evil” is in the bible.
But you can’t sell me short. I said the definition of love starts with giving. The bible uses charity as a synonym for love.
But you’re right, the definition takes new meaning when you say “the love of money.” Because instead of being a verb, love takes a different form, a noun.
This is too much. lol. we need to stop. We’re really arguing semantics and working our heads too tough. lol.
@Everybody,
Love is just a word. You’re getting hung up on the vocabulary.
What love is or isn’t is extremely subjective as seen in the thread above. Self love IS selfish, as the suffix -ish implies it is about, like and regarding one’s self. BUT… There’s nothing wrong with that. You can be selfish sometimes and sometimes you can be selfless but like someone already mentioned, “all things in moderation”…
@ChocolateGirlWonder,
“Self love IS selfish, as the suffix -ish implies it is about, like and regarding one’s self. BUT… There’s nothing wrong with that.”
*nods*
I think it’s the connotation associated with the word “selfish” that makes us reject it. If you say it one way, there isn’t anything wrong with it, say it another, and it is. I guess it depends on the implication behind the word.
uh I gotta agree a little bit on this one. I agree that this ego pimpin is a defense mechanism. However it also serves the dual, but not as beneficial, purpose of being yet another wall a person has to break through to get to know the real you and vice versa and most people never make it past those first superficial meetings.
It is also hard to flip the switch from, just doing me and being me and putting me first, to being genuinely concerned about the thoughts and feelings of someone else, which is what both good s.e.x and good relationships are made of. So if you only worried about “gettin yours” in the bed or in the relationship, unless the other person possesses the altruistic qualities of say, Mother Theresa or Florence Nightingale , the relationship is doomed before it starts…
@shay_d_lady,
“this ego pimpin is a defense mechanism. However it also serves the dual, but not as beneficial, purpose of being yet another wall a person has to break through to get to know the real you”
Agreed. Despite what their MySpace accounts may tell you, I’m not convinced that people think anymore highly of themselves now than they did 50 or 100 years ago. Braggadociousness + a sense of entitlement does NOT equate to high self-esteem or conceit.
Aside from making people scared to show vulnerability, this self-absorption makes people oblivious to what’s going on in their mate’s heads/hearts. That’s what I think the real danger is.
@Me fail english?,
“Braggadociousness + a sense of entitlement does NOT equate to high self-esteem or conceit.”
word. i know many a combination of high ego-low self-esteem. Basically ends up being that I think I’m great but I’m surprised if anyone else agrees with me. Which is definitely a defense mechanism and I think brought on by what the article is talking about. Continuously telling people to love yourself means a person can buildup their ego really high but still not do one bit of work on the self-esteem. but ego can work as a good mask for self-esteem and fool people (like the people in the article) who don’t know more than the superficial aspect of a person.
So in truth, I don’t think people are more selfish than before but people do know how to answer a question in a way that will be approved by your average talk-show host. How does this work for relationships? I think it like watching turtles get busy. (however I’ve seen free range turtles in a zoo so I’m not worried. A little scarred but not worried)
@willnotbetelevised,
LOL. I have NO idea what its like to watch turtles get busy. But 100% cosignage
@Me fail english?,
“I have NO idea what its like to watch turtles get busy.”
Girl, I saw that on the Discovery channel years ago. They do it sideways!! I was like, “the hell goin’ on on my screen?” It just felt so dirty, lol.
@Me fail english?,
I also wonder if their shell serves as a giant condom. It seems like it gets in the way.
@Me fail english?,
Turtles get busy ALLADATIME! but they move really really REALLY slow. It was crazy. I watched a female turtle get chased by this smaller male turtle and they were like 3″ away from each other but it took him 10 minutes to chase her down and mount. She was still ‘running’ when he was on that shell. But my thing is turtles get love too. Just slower. and you’re halfway there before you even realize to stop running. but since you’re moving so slow it doesn’t really matter.
Watching a turtle run on 2 legs would be a great pasttime if it weren’t for the purpose.
@Me fail english?,
I’m not convinced that people think anymore highly of themselves now than they did 50 or 100 years ago. Braggadociousness + a sense of entitlement does NOT equate to high self-esteem or conceit.
i think its a bit of a chicken/egg thing. we have outlets that people didnt have 50 or even 10 years ago, so that might give the false impression that we’re more self-contained when its just the fact that we now have more opportunities and venues to show the self-containment.
still, while this may be true, i do think that the tons of social media present (as well as many other things) have made us more likely to self-fellate.
@The Champ,
“have made us more likely to self-fellate.”
LOL. I agree, but does this greater likelihood mean we truly think we’re better as people than our granparents thought they were? A rise in the rates of “reported” cases of eating disorders, body dysmorphic disorders, suicides and drug addictions makes me think: maybe not.
“Twentysomethings not only expect to waltz into high-level career positions right out of college, they also expect partners who have the moral fortitude of Nelson Mandela, the comedic timing of Stephen Colbert, the abs of Hugh Jackman, and the hair of Patrick Dempsey.”
^^^^That’s so Pedestal Patty. <— Google her …
to the question, though: Selfishness sabotages. There’s a fine line between conceitedness and self-reflection/introspection that we toe as people. Though, that line widens when selfishness comes into the picture.
There’s nothing wrong with thinking highly of yourself. But you have to put and keep that in perspective and be humble. Keep yourself on an even playing field with the people you deal encounter.
If you put yourself on a pedestal, and see yourself as above common folk, you will likely be a lonely person who keeps running into people who are only trying to knock you off your perch to get in your pants.
@thismayconcernyou,
“Twentysomethings not only expect to waltz into high-level career positions right out of college, …”
that irritated me so much. Its akin to to the old man in the rocking chair shaking his fist talking about kids these days and how he used to walk 10 miles to school barefoot in the snow. Except now they have supposed data from to people today to scientifically compare to their memories of how they were when they were in their 20s. Grr.
Plus I don’t know what she means by high paying job but considering all the hype about going to college I think anyone with a degree expects a significantly higher paying entry-level position than one you could get without a degree. Otherwise what was the point of wasting those years racking up student loans.
@willnotbetelevised,
“I think anyone with a degree expects a significantly higher paying entry-level position than one you could get without a degree. ”
That really grinds my gears. There was a time when Bachelor’s degrees weren’t so common and it actually could get you somewhere. In some fields its still true, but a lot of folks got the bait and switch pulled on em. Graduated and wound up doing stuff they were qualified to do straight outta high school. Doesnt mean we’re entitled. Just means we got duped, miseducated and under-utilized..
@willnotbetelevised,
“Plus I don’t know what she means by high paying job but considering all the hype about going to college I think anyone with a degree expects a significantly higher paying entry-level position than one you could get without a degree. Otherwise what was the point of wasting those years racking up student loans.”
lol, not to nitpick, but doesn’t this completely contradict your first paragraph?
I just thought about it being overly selfLESS is not ideal, being a doormat is not attractive no matter the gender….
@Naturally Alise,
You shouldn’t be a doormat, but you also shouldn’t be on a pedestal. Just stand up and walk upright with some confidence, and you’ll run into what you’re looking for, iThink. lol.
Aren’t all extremes a form of insecurity?? Too selfless, too selfish, too cocky, too passive, too whatever, just a defense mechanism to either draw people in or keep people out. I don’t think human beings are emotionally equipped to be constantly on one extreme end of any spectrum. You’ll have your selfish days and your selfless days in any releationship. If you are constantly at one end or the other than you must really be working at it.
I think the problem with my generation (I’m in my 20s) is a phuckallsized case of entitlement. We think we deserve every good and perfect thing in the world by putting in just the minimum effort. This sense of entitlement spills over from the work place into our personal lives as well. As my mother always says “the world don’t owe you sh!t.”
@ofloveandotherdemons,
100% Cosign!
Oh, how I’ve missed you!
@ofloveandotherdemons,
Aren’t all extremes a form of insecurity?? Too selfless, too selfish, too cocky, too passive, too whatever, just a defense mechanism to either draw people in or keep people out.
Yup, I think so. Although I wouldnt want to date an ego maniac, I also wouldnt want to date a guy with super-low self esteem. Its too much work. And I agree that they’re both opposite ends of the same depressing spectrum. Both types of guys are trying to pump themselves up, just going about it in different ways. Its really not worth the headache to have either type around.
@ofloveandotherdemons, “I think the problem with my generation (I’m in my 20s) is a phuckallsized case of entitlement. We think we deserve every good and perfect thing in the world by putting in just the minimum effort”
I blame those ‘participation’ ribbons they handed out during Field day in elementary school. You lost, you should’nt get a ribbon for showing up.
@Mr. Mister,
My class staged a mini rebellion in the 5th grade because of this. They made us play the special ed team at baseball and made all these bogus calls to make it seem like we lost…just cause those kids were special ed. This aint the special olympics!! Just cause them lil ninjas don’t read good, dont mean they get a pass for not hitting the fastball!!!
*still salty*
You may have been joking, but I’m all about teaching kids meritocracy early. Even if the country doesn’t really work that way, it places a premium on excellence that I think kids should learn to value early on.
@Me fail english?,
“My class staged a mini rebellion in the 5th grade because of this. They made us play the special ed team at baseball and made all these bogus calls to make it seem like we lost…just cause those kids were special ed. This aint the special olympics!! Just cause them lil ninjas don’t read good, dont mean they get a pass for not hitting the fastball!!!”
This is sooooo funny, yet so evil at the same time…
@Mr. Mister, i agree with you 100%.
just because you showed up does not mean you should be rewarded. i was in school with plenty of people that thought that just because they got a degree from x elite school, they should be entitled a well paying job right outta college. NO, your C average in leisure studies does NOT entitle you to anything above minimum wage, i’m sorry. and i’ve worked with a few as well. NO, you coming to work 30 minutes late everyday, turning in status reports late, and dozing off in meetings does NOT entitle you to a promotion. I don’t care if you’ve been in the same position for 3 years.
*end venting*
@ofloveandotherdemons,
Bravo!!! Bravo!!! Mad co-signage to the whole post!!!
@ofloveandotherdemons,
“We think we deserve every good and perfect thing in the world by putting in just the minimum effort.”
**nodding head**
@ofloveandotherdemons,
“We think we deserve every good and perfect thing in the world by putting in just the minimum effort.”
Black Entertainment Television? Take heed of the above message. lol
@Cheekie,
LMAO. Apparently, BET is in its twenties too. Lol!
To the East, my brotha to the East…ok had to get that out of my system since you used the term vainglorious, lol.
Now…
“is this selfishness self-sabotaging ourselves, or is this conceitedness crucial to surviving now?”
Yes, the selfishness/conceitedness is definitely sabotaging this generation, and it’s no more crucial to survival than “Bounce” dryer sheets are to washing clothes.
I blame BET and music videos combined because of the overuse of gratuitous booty and pretty faces being splayed all over the screens. It’s not really a matter of being naturally conceited, but when you see cockroaches like Lil Wayne or T-Pain flaunting dimes, you begin to believe, “Hell, if HE can get it, I KNOW I can.”
It’s a fallacy because NEITHER of them could get it on their BEST day if they didn’t have that bread. So, instead of looking for Miss Right, they’re looking for a dime that they can flaunt to their homeboys – nevermind the fact that she’s no good, nevermind the fact that she has 6 kids and no job – it’s all about appearances and impressing folks with that eye/arm candy.
Sadly, they don’t realize until it’s too late that the ONE they needed to be with (maybe not the cutest thing in the world) is the one that would have made life complete. When it all boils down to it, I have to say YES, it’s self-sabotage on the utmost of superficial levels.
Wait, did that even make sense? I’m sleepy, lol. If it didn’t make sense, I’ll elaborate tomorrow. Keep in mind I’ve been sick all day, so I’m not functioning at full capacity, lol.
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken, You made complete sense!
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken,
“To the East, my brotha to the East…ok had to get that out of my system since you used the term vainglorious, lol.”
Sissies!!!!!!!
@miss t-lee,
You beat me to it.
*snatches off Africa medallion and nose ring*
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken, I blame BET and music videos combined because of the overuse of gratuitous booty and pretty faces being splayed all over the screens. It’s not really a matter of being naturally conceited, but when you see cockroaches like Lil Wayne or T-Pain flaunting dimes, you begin to believe, “Hell, if HE can get it, I KNOW I can.”
I dont know that we can blame BET for all the problems that exist in society…
and also unattractive people with money being entirely over confident is not something that recently came about with the creation of young/cash money and reintroduction of auto tune… LOL
@shay_d_lady,
Agree 100%.
And this –>unattractive people with money being entirely over confident is not something that recently came about <– is the truth.com.
@shay_d_lady,
“I dont know that we can blame BET for all the problems that exist in society…”
I’m not blaming them for ALL the problems that exist in society – only the one I mentioned.
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken,
“It’s not really a matter of being naturally conceited, but when you see cockroaches like Lil Wayne or T-Pain flaunting dimes, you begin to believe, “Hell, if HE can get it, I KNOW I can.””
What a great point. I hate how ninjas be conceited and have n’an reason for it but dolla bills. Does anyone have STANDARDS nowadays? Or can they just simply be bought?
Also, I’m mad at how your username always makes me tummy grumble.
@Cheekie,
“Also, I’m mad at how your username always makes me tummy grumble.”
Sorry bout that, Girl, lol.
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken,
LOL, Luckily, it’s almost lunchtime.
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken,
full co-signage. And if your handle said “baked” instead of fried chicken, I’d be extra hungry right now.
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken,
It’s a fallacy because NEITHER of them could get it on their BEST day if they didn’t have that bread.
on the flipside, would any of those “dime piece” women been able to bag a popular millionaire if not for their bread? (and, by “bread” i mean “God-given or surgically enhanced t and a”)
i mean, people always talk about how lucky jay-z is to be with a chick like bey, but do you think beyonce’s bamma ass would have been able to have men worth 9 figures wanting to marry her if she looked like tayshaun prince?
in this regard, she’s just as lucky.
@The Champ,
I agree.
And I often think, people assume there is a difference because money CAN be made, while beauty is “god” given and can’t really (truly) be improved upon…
To me, they are both equal… Because it’s some type of talent and/or business acumen that makes you rich… except if you’re Paris Hilton of course.
@The Champ,
“on the flipside, would any of those “dime piece” women been able to bag a popular millionaire if not for their bread? (and, by “bread” i mean “God-given or surgically enhanced t and a”)”
Nope. It does go both ways like you said. But that doesn’t make it any less superficial or self-sabotaging when it comes to relationships.
@RedBeanzNRice w/Fried Chicken,
cockroaches like Lil Wayne or T-Pain
Question: What makes them cockroaches? Having “dreads?” Having the dark skin that they do? A combination of both? Or is this simply because you genuinely find them physically ugly?
@Stuff Ghetto People Like,
“Or is this simply because you genuinely find them physically ugly?”
Yes. Genuinely.
@Stuff Ghetto People Like,
I happen to LOVE me some dark skinned man with locs **memories**…
but these guys… without the money… sheeit, even with the money. No bueno. One looks like he doesn’t bathe and the other is the Ghost of Coon Present with his Big Arse Chain. iCant.
@Stuff Ghetto People Like,
I find nothing aesthetically pleasing about the two, either. Not like a Picasso, they are.
OK, ladies…just making sure it wasn’t a whole lotta self-hatin’ goin’ on.
Took a minute to digest what you were saying…
Me, I see it like this.
Selfish usually = egotistical bastich, which = high maintenance snob and that = not my kind of woman.
Gotta have some kind of humility and empathy about you.
@Stuff Ghetto People Like,
i like equations and sh*t
Good post again, Champ. Somebody’s been eating their Wheaties, tee hee.
Ne who. I think that balance is the key to life. But it seems like us Black folks tend to live in the land of extremes. In many of our communities there’s little room for relaxed living. I think little black kids learn this young cause it’s a jungle out there. And when they grow up they bring this baggage into their relationships. They grow up to be pimps (maybe not literally but lots of men think there’s nothing wrong with gaming and living off a woman)/ hos (lots of women provide a rest haven for these men) (and vice-versa ex: captain save a ho, captain save a bro lol) and other extreme personalities in between. But these are all a form of the ego and are born from insecurities. Not ego in the sense that I’m the shit – bow down (although it does translate like that a lot), but the ego as a persona that one clings to when one is challenged or provoked.
@pgh muse,
and if this is incomprehensible, i’m sorry. basically moral of the story is it’s not ever healthy to think its all about you all the time – all about u thinking you’re the shit or all about you thinking u ain’t shit…
@pgh muse,
“the ego as a persona that one clings to when one is challenged or provoked.”
Yes ma’am. I’m smthg of a psych nerd so I always get tripped up when people use “ego” and “conceit” interchangably.
@pgh muse,
thanks and sh*t. it hasn’t been wheaties though. just ralston and cream of wheat
I just heard on Steve Harvey that MJ’s second accuser of molestation came out and said publicly that Michael never touched him. That is some BULLSHYT!
@pgh muse,
Already knew it was straight bullshiggidy. Both of them li’l ninjas and their greedy triflin azz parents.
He only paid so that he could have peace. Its a shame he had to leave this world to find it.
RIP MJJ.
@blackberry molasses, Lawd. I swear that shyt hurt my heart. Poor Michael.
@blackberry molasses,
argh… I just listened to “Heaven Can Wait” WHY DID I DO THAT?!?!?!
Gotta re-apply the mascara/kohl now.
@blackberry molasses,
*long distance hug*
@pgh muse, They need to go to hell. I think he prolly took a lot of drugs to numb the pain and scruitiny of the media because of these a**holes.
I’m not a MJ ryda, but this situation is so fugged up on every level.
@pgh muse,
Wowwwwwww. :shaking my head:
dayum shame.
@pgh muse,
LOL. I knew it from day one! Hearing the 1993 guy recant shocked me. But the 2005 shet was COMPLETE BOOSHEET!!
I feel like the Dad of the ’93 guy and the mother of the ’05 guy should be brought up on some sort of charges for that, in addition to all the people who lied on the stand.
R. Kelly juxtaposition deez!
@Me fail english? and everyone, I swear that shyt had me wanting to fight when I heard it. I remember when MJ had the FOI as his bodyguards for a period back in the day… If I was MJ’s peoples I’d be trying fcuk some shyt up right now.
@pgh muse,
Im not a vengeful person (anymore
), especially not long after the ish went down but I sincerely hopes this weighs on both of the accusers’ heads until they die. I really feel like they hastened his death with the stress of it all. Not to mention this ’05 bastard is the reason he had to sell Neverland.
@Me fail english?,
yea mike aint that crazy and i always knew he wouldnt do that money is the root of all evil
@BLUNTBLAZER, ugh!
I don’t even want to think about it. Them fc*kers.
@Me fail english?,
“I feel like the Dad of the ‘93 guy and the mother of the ‘05 guy should be brought up on some sort of charges for that, in addition to all the people who lied on the stand. ”
For real. That’s some federal level foolery.
@pgh muse,
Yeah, someone told me that, too.
That’s some straight horse bowel-movement. Wow…perfect timing. *eyeroll*
@pgh muse,
That is so sad I wonder how those people can live with themselves (both accusers & families). I remember watching the 2003 special and all I could think of was how sad and misunderstood Michael Jackson is. I cry when I think about how people hurt him. He was too gentle for the mean world around him. The only thing good is no one can hurt him anymore.
@pinksghetti,
agreed. i do weep for MJ. like literally. every time i think about it, i just get so sad. he really was a gentle soul. misunderstood. misconstrued.
i believe all of it had a hand in doing him in.
@blackberry molasses,
When I read that on here my eyes weld up with tears. The fact that they waited until it was too late for Michael Jackson to hear them shows how evil they are.
I’m going to call all sorts of bullsh*t and shenanigans on that article.
Low self esteem is a killer. I have my own stuff to deal with. To have to then take care of someone who is many respects is the emotional equivalent of a 14 year old is a bit much.
I can see this problem being very exacerbated if the other person in the relationship is a narcissist. I want to read the actual experiment protocols and results before I even consider ascribing some semblance of truth to the conclusions.
Everyone knows there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. Unfortunately, by their very nature, unless one is actually a statistician, it is quite easy for everyone else, including engineers, physicists, psychologists, other mathematicians, etc to draw conclusions that are not entailed by the data (or worse yet, conclusions to questions you didn’t even ask or correctly ask).
@kamakula,
Low self-esteem and emotional/mental immaturity are 2 completely different things to me. A 35 year old man that looks and plays the part could ultimately have low self-esteem when it comes to certain aspects of their life.
Just for the record, I’m not a 35 year old man. Not even close.
@Slim Jackson 2.0,
This is also true. I know some 14 year old girls that seem mighty pleased with themselves.
And I find young ppl much easier to deal with then ppl with negative views of themselves
@kamakula,
“Unfortunately, by their very nature, unless one is actually a statistician, it is quite easy for everyone else, including engineers, physicists, psychologists, other mathematicians, etc to draw conclusions that are not entailed by the data (or worse yet, conclusions to questions you didn’t even ask or correctly ask).”
Preach that truth!! I’m so tired of hearing articles summarizing “findings” when we don’t even know how the question was framed! Why don’t you just come out and tell us what to think.
@Me fail english?,
Statisitcs is my thing. Its what I actually get PAID to do. And it is so easy to ‘lie’ with statistics.
Things like recall bias, selection bias etc. can make the data come to a pre-determined conclusion. The other question I have is about their sample? Who the f*ck is in this study? Are they generalizable to the rest of humanity? Or just a tiny slice.
I need to see this study. I’ll bet its full of more holes than Champs underwear.
@blackberry molasses,
“The other question I have is about their sample? Who the f*ck is in this study? Are they generalizable to the rest of humanity?”
Im a psych chick, so I dont wanna sound like a traitor to my race or anything, but a lot of these social psych experiments/studies are purely anecdotal and can’t be extended to anyone outside the damn study! Esp. observations made outside of a controlled environment.
How much you wanna bet the low self-esteem ppl are said to have “just as good” relations because they, themselves rated it that way? How much you wanna bet what they consider exceeding expectations for a personal interaction doesn’t even approach what some people would consider a solid state of affairs.
Bell Curve ass ninjas.
@Me fail english?,
I’m still mad about The Bell Curve…
boosheet!
@Me fail english?,
“Im a psych chick”
You too? No wonder we’s cool.
@blackberry molasses, “I’ll bet its full of more holes than Champs underwear.”
I almost choked on my Mate, good job e-mama!
As someone who is indeed the $hi+, I feel like I am uniquely qualified to speak on the issue. While I agree that a certain mindset can be damaging for productive relationships, its kind of messed up to expect someone to settle. My sisters out there who feel like they need an ambitious, smart and good looking dude should hold out till they get one. Fellas who are on their grind should not have to settle for anyone less than their perfect match. I don’t think the problem is peoples ego, I think the problem is in the past society settled for less than happy.
@Dorian G.,
“I think the problem is in the past society settled for less than happy.”
Great point. I think alot of these conclusions are drawn based on what Champ calls “technicolor memories”. You know the romanticized, “Leave It to Beaver”, chicken in every pot version of the good ol’ days.
Nevermind that back in the good ol’ days, housewives were poppin all types of pills, there were as many Peg&Al/Archie&Edith rel’ships as there were Reed families (probably more), and people generally felt trapped. There was an entire women’s movement fought in large part due to the “success” (read: failure) of the “grow up and be a wife” plan.
To each his own, I just don’t think that what this generation is doing (taking longer to settle down, having babies at a later age) is so much than the previous generation. Every change has positive and negative effects. Nature of the beast.
I don’t want to settle. Not out of conceit. But because I grew up around married people who took what they could get. Other than my parents, they’re all miserable. In fact, seeing my parents coming through their hard times only convinced me that I’d HAVE to be head over heels, looney tunes crazy in love to stay married past 7 years. Otherwise I might be one of those ladies that abandons the family and joins the circus or smthg. I hate the circus
@Me fail english?, seeing my parents coming through their hard times only convinced me that I’d HAVE to be head over heels, looney tunes crazy in love to stay married past 7 years
CHUUCH!
@Me fail english?,
I think a lot of our generations problem is that we expect so much more out of our partner than our parents or grandparents did back then. Since we’ve got the degrees, house, car, and all the trappings of success, we view pairing up with anyone who has less than that as “settling.” I feel like a lot of that (combined with out own conceit) allows us to overlook perfectly suitable mates as insufficient. All we’re doing is searching for a myth and shortchanging our selves.
Black Bond has a great article on the demise of the Come Up together Couple that touches on the same subject.
@Dom,
“Come Up together Couple”
That sounds interesting. I agree it’s unfortunate. I think ppl can’t see the forest for the trees and I know plenty of folks that should re-think their criteria. In a perfect world, some of these criteria wouldn’t make the list!
I just dont think the best advice for these ppl is to “Settle down. You’re not so great yourself.” Cause once they follow that advice they’re gonna be even less happy than before. If they’re not introspective enough to figure out on their own maybe a compassion and patience is more important than a six pack they weren’t built for marriage in the first place and the “settling” arrangement is doomed.
I guess Im saying nobody should ever feel they settled.
@Me fail english?,
Yeah, I think we’re saying two different things. I personally feel that more often than not, thats exactly what people need to be told. I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with thinking highly of yourself but some of the ish I see out here with peoples attitudes is ridic. People need to get over themselves and get out of their own way, especaially if they are looking for a relationship/marriage.
Anywhoo, The Black Bond Blog is serious. The link to the Come Up Article: http://blkbond.blogspot.com/2009/03/what-happened-to-come-up-together.html
@Dom,
But you can see why that sounds ridiculous tho right? Lets regroup and start from the beginning. I’m not of the belief that one HAS to pair up to be happy. If you are “up there” and feel like you can’t find anyone to match you, then why should you settle? Even if you’re not all that great yourself and only a god in your own mind, that unhappiness will now ruin two people (you and the person you settled for), maybe even more if y’all have kids.
@Dom,
And I just read BlkBond’s post, and really it has nothing to do with what we’re talking about here.
@Dorian G.
No, to me it doesnt sound ridiculous at all. In many ways, people who are up on their high horse are blocking their blessings with their inflated egos.
If you as a man, think you’re too good for 100% of the women you meet b/c you have this that and the third, then he** be by yourself. But if you WANT to be a part of a fulfilling relationship with a woman, you need to bring yourself down to earth a bit.
The reference to the Come Up Couple was for the original Me Fail comment that waiting to get married and have kids is no worse than what our grandparents did in marrying young. I was using it to illustrate a point that although we feel like we’re settling, we should be viewing each relationships as an opportunity to build something together. Thats lost on todays youth.
@Dorian G.,
1000% cosign
@Dom,
But what could you have built if you feel you just got stuck with a loser? I don’t care if the “loser” you had to “settle” with Barack Obama and Idris Elba combined. If you’re not happy there or possibly not mature enough to appreciate what you have, you are doomed to fail. The “come up” relationship only works well when both participants wanted to be there. That’s not what happens when you settle.
@Me Fail,
I am not saying you should settle for a loser or someone that you dont respect. Or even that you have to settle at all. If you’re so great at being you then be dynamic by yourself.
But if you’re looking to be coupled and can’t seem to find anyone who meets your standards, you need to take a look at whats going on in your own head and re-evalutate your priorities. Getting over some of your own issues makes it easier to feel like you’re gaining something as opposed to losing when in a relationship.
@Me fail english?,
seeing my parents coming through their hard times only convinced me that I’d HAVE to be head over heels, looney tunes crazy in love to stay married past 7 years
That is the gospel truth!! That’s the only reason I KNOW for a fact that I won’t be able to marry for “convenience”…
@Dorian G., my only problem with your post is that people often times define “settle” as having realistic expectations.
A lot of people, have these fairy tale dreams of the perfect person, on some I deserve all of this because I am the shyt type of mess.. but in reality they are not the shyt and how do you hold someone to a standard you cant even stand on your tippy toes to meet?
A lot of people, have these fairy tale dreams of the perfect person, on some I deserve all of this because I am the shyt type of mess..
Exactly! And beyond that, lets say you are the sh*t, doesnt mean you deserve a damn thing! Good relationships take work! What you deserve isnt going to fall in your lap one day!
@shay_d_lady,
But what’s realistic to you may be unbearable to the next person. I agree there are some people who are overthinking their standards with long lists of stuff that isn’t going to help maintain a long-term bond. But these people need time to mature to the point where they can change what they value. That way they’ll feel they struck gold; not like they settled. Cause isn’t that what makes a romance so special, that its NOT a common occurence or smthg you had to settle into like an old couch.
You’ve gotta wonder if someone who places so much value on their mate’s chiseled abs that they’d turn down the seemingly perfect out-of-shape dude, would be mature/dedicated to make a real go of it with spare tire dude. My guess: no. In which case, aren’t they doing everyone a HUGE favor by not “settling” and getting married? Self selection.
@Me fail english?,
You are on a roll today Ms. Lady. Totally agree.
The people with the outrageous list shouldn’t be told to settle, they should be left alone to mature. That’s the only way, they can become the type of people who make relationships flourish… Until then, it’s just delaying or displacing the problem. In other words, it’s not the ridiculous list that is the problem. The ridiculous list is just a symptom of a bigger problem: Emotional immaturity…
@Me fail english?, But what’s realistic to you may be unbearable to the next person. I agree there are some people who are overthinking their standards with long lists of stuff that isn’t going to help maintain a long-term bond
and those are the ones I am referring too, I am not try to push my standards on others but those people whose standards require a lab and a frankenstein type scientist to create that ninja or ninjet…
@shay_d_lady,
I think this is where the disconnect is, what I’m saying is that those standards, are THEIR standards. It doesn’t make it right or wrong, realistic or unrealistic, its just theirs.
As a society we’re too consumed with trying to tell others what to do and to conform when in fact no 2 people’s reality are the same.
For example, I got a boy who only dates dime pieces. After he broke up with his college girlfriend (who was maybe a 5), he said thats it, I’m not talking to a woman unless she’s a 9 or above. Obviously we clowned him for it, but guess what, 2 years later and the past 5 or 6 chicks he’s been with are straight up dimes. Is he a perfect catch? No, but that was his standard and it might have seemed unrealistic at the beginning but he made it work. Thats also the reason I don’t look down on women who have income standards for potential boyfriends. If I’m not it, no sweat off my back, I’ll keep it moving and you do the same. So I guess what I’m saying is really, just do you.
@Dorian G., is your boy attractive?
@shay_d_lady, j
How can you define someone else’s reality??? Lemme ask you a question, when Michelle Obama was in Harvard Law, or even when she graduated and got that job at the law firm, don’t you think people were telling her to find a good man who at least went to college, cuz there was no chance she would find a black man on her level? What if she settled then? I just think its extremely patronizing to tell someone that what they are looking for is “unrealistic”
@Dorian G., when Michelle Obama was in Harvard Law, or even when she graduated and got that job at the law firm, don’t you think people were telling her to find a good man who at least went to college, cuz there was no chance she would find a black man on her level? What if she settled then? I just think its extremely patronizing to tell someone that what they are looking for is “unrealistic”
umm.. lets not do the michelle obama her level on the time was a black ivy league student…. but lets take this example shall we? Michelle obviously had realistic expectations cause she dated a funny looking, guy with charisma, who was just deciding what he wanted to do with his life.
had she held out for the president of the united states or CEO with six figures, benzes and Denzel type looks she would be a single chicky…
@Dorian G., just think its extremely patronizing to tell someone that what they are looking for is “unrealistic”
well maybe the truth is patronizing.. I am not telling someone what to look for but I do think its unrealistic for you to hold people to a standard they themselves cannot meet.
@Dorian G.,
How can you define someone else’s reality???
Everyone internalizing this=World Peace
@ofloveandotherdemons,
LOL so in other words, you are nominating me for the Nobel Peace Prize.
I humbly accept.
@shay_d_lady, and also I didnt say tell them I said I think people often define settling as having realistic expectations… they are two different things…
@Dorian G.,
I think the problem is in the past society settled for less than happy.
It looks like everybody has been on their wisdom regimen this week. It’s a good look!
@Sula, It is a great look. God wants us to be happy. lol. He told me
and **waving**
Hi e-twin! I’ve felt incomplete and bisected w/o u
@pgh muse,
Hi e-twin darling! These TETs have me working like a jewish Donkey! But it’s all good… I’ll make a way.
How are the kiddies?
@Sula,
They r good e-twizzy! Thanks for asking
I think the problem is in the past society settled for less than happy
how do we know past society didnt hold out for the good shyt and it turned out to be not what they expected?
I know a lot of people that on their list of what they want in a man/or woman, they never include how that person will Love them, respect, them etc..
maybe they got their list?
@Dorian G.,
I think the problem is in the past society settled for less than happy.
good point and sh*t.
thing is, maybe it was easier to be happy 50 years ago than now, especially when you had less external stimuli creating expectations of yourself.
@The Champ,
Maybe but i’m in the middle of catching up on Mad Men, and those settling ni99as don’t seem happy to me either.
@Dorian G.,
Did the new season start already? Say it ain’t so… please.
But to come back to your Mad Men reference, yes, those ninjas were NOT happy. Especially the women!! Revolutionary Road alone is a clear counterpoint to the premise of this article.
@Sula,
My grandparents would make a great counterpoint to this article! Ever since I known them, they been old as hell. When you’re old and have less options, settling becomes easier and you may get the impression that settling is a peaceful, non-lumpy existence. Good thing my Dad has HD memory (it has a use after all!!) and knows that it wasnt always like that.
@The Champ,
“maybe it was easier to be happy 50 years ago than now, especially when you had less external stimuli creating expectations of yourself.”
Hmm. The plot thickens….
**about to majorly share a deep dark personal truth**
As someone who suffered from extremely low self esteem, depression and suicidal thoughts for many years, I have to call BOOSHEET on the article.
Granted, my situation was extreme and required professional help (and sometimes on really bad days, those demons rear their ugly heads) but if you don’t love yourself, you truly are incapable of loving someone else or letting them love you.
If you are down on yourself, even just a little bit, you start to accept the unacceptable because you think its the best you can do. Self sabotaging and destructive thoughts like:
“No one would want me anyway, so I better take what Ican get, or risk being alone and unloved.”
“Well, I don’t need to stand my ground on this one, because they will get upset and leave me”
Its not about being selfish (although sometimes, being a little bit selfish is actually good for you). Its about understanding your value as a person who deserves and owes yourself the best. That doesn’t mean you don’t have to put in work, that you don’t have to compromise and that you walk around with a huge azz ego and unmerited sense of entitlement. Humility is always key. But you can be humble, giving and loving to others, while still loving yourself.
Humans are capable of amazing duality. This is prally the best kind.
@blackberry molasses, I was definitely there right there with you at one point in life.
This…. “you truly are incapable of loving someone else or letting them love you. ”
is the truth.
@blackberry molasses,
Thanks for sharing that girlie.
@blackberry molasses,
So happy you decided to share that. Thank you.
“you can be humble, giving and loving to others, while still loving yourself.
Humans are capable of amazing duality. ”
I agree. My issue with calling self-love “selfish” is that we all know that words carries the connotation that one is self-involved to the detriment of and/or at the expense of others. Which is completely false.
I’m a “type-A” and my own worst critic. It also made me a critical, cynical harsh betch. I’ve found that in being more patient and understanding of myself, it’s easier to see light in others.
How can you appreciate the loyalty, intellect, humor, beauty in anyone else if you’re too blind to even see it in the mirror? I question, what exactly DO you recognize in the person you claim to love? A lot of times it’s just their partner’s willingness to stay. I’m not going to say that’s not love, but it seems kind’ve empty. Like you’re missing out on how full the rel’ship could be and not loving to maximum potential.
@blackberry molasses,
Thank god you worked through that and are in a better place. I know I dont know you in real life, but even here on VSB things would NOT be the same without you.
@Dom,
awwwwww…. **hugs**
that was so smooshy!! loves it!!
yes, I said smooshy. Smooshy is awesome.
@blackberry molasses and dom,
get a room.
seriously though, i appreciate you being able to share that with us, and despite the fact that you’re from philly, i am glad that you were able to work through those issues.
@Dom, I 2nd that, she’s been the best e-mama I ever did have, and I can’t imagine a bbmo that wasn’t fabulous, amazing and glittery ALL the time.
Air hug mama:)
@blackberry molasses,
Your comment just made this little light of mine shine.
Great advice!
@blackberry molasses,
Thanks for sharing, dahling.
The author seems to think that a good sense and appreciation of self is mutually exclusive with an understanding that others do exist.
@blackberry molasses, I think it is very brave that you shared this ma’am. And also awesome that you pulled through. I went through a dark time myself at the ripe old age of like 19 – but it really was a spiritual breakthrough. I was feeling low – like what’s the point of living low… and I don’t even remember what the circumstance was surrounding my depression. But I remember the evening well that I was feeling so low and having such bad thoughts because I swear a voice told me I would be alright and I never ever felt that low again. God is real, excuse me as I testify lol.
I think the problem is not high self esteem in a relationship, the problem lies in INFLATED self esteem.
People with low self esteem have to be handled with care, you constantly have to baby sit them… why would anyone want to deal with that? That would be straining on a relationship. You’d become their crutch.
A person with INFLATED self esteem is not going to compromise, as you said.
@Nicki Sunshine,
Great distinction. Its all relative. I mean if Denzel Washington feels he’s entitled to more money per film than Will Smith…is that really conceit? Depends on who you feel would bring more value to a film. People with high self-esteem don’t need to be knocked down to size, they need to go find people who see them as they see themselves.
I think this is why my rel’ship works right now. A lot of men would probably say I’m good looking, down to earth and can carry a conversation but that I lack grace or class. I cuss too much. I talk too loud. I argue too long. I’m too silly.
I happen to love my boisterous personality and slapstick sense of humor. You mean to tell me, if I didnt happen to find a man that loves it too, I shoulda just got with a dude who’d merely “tolerate” what I absolutely love about myself? Isn’t relationship-seeking a selfish pursuit on its face??
@Me fail english?, Thanks ma’am.
” happen to love my boisterous personality and slapstick sense of humor. You mean to tell me, if I didnt happen to find a man that loves it too, I shoulda just got with a dude who’d merely “tolerate” what I absolutely love about myself? ”
Or that you should attempt to change who you are in order to find a man that is comfortable?
Uh NOOO.
@Nicki Sunshine,
Exactly. That would make me HATE my life. And what’s the point of rel’ship if not to share your happiness with another? If Im gonna be unhappy, Id rather be by myself.
@Me fail english?, If Im gonna be unhappy, Id rather be by myself.”
AMEN
@Me fail english?,
“I think this is why my rel’ship works right now. A lot of men would probably say I’m good looking, down to earth and can carry a conversation but that I lack grace or class. I cuss too much. I talk too loud. I argue too long. I’m too silly.”
Excuse me, have we met before??? ;o) I can definitely feel you on this. It’s not okay to just accept someone who will simply “tolerate” what I love most about me…like, seriously??
*high five*
“People are not willing to compromise, or willing to be patient.”
Yep!!!
There’s nothing wrong with being a bit selfish, I’m steadily telling my friends (kats and chicks) that you have to be to an extent. Take some time for yourself, if it’s all about the other person 24/7, where does that leave you?
Oh yeah and self-esteem? I’ve got an abundance. It’s both a good and bad thing. My parents definitely didn’t play in that department. Plus, being the only team chunk member outta all my siblings, I think they laid it on extra thick…lol
I can deal with that though.
*goes back to basking in her post Maxwell concert glow.
@miss t-lee,
*goes back to basking in her post Maxwell concert glow*
BI*CH.
@blackberry molasses,
*snickering*
hate is soooo not becoming on you.
@blackberry molasses,
T-Lee is one of those chicks always posting on her Facebook:
“Just got back from the Maxwell concert” 12 hours ago
“Late to lobster and shrimp dinner with Barack Obama” 9 hours ago
“Just DIDN’T pay state income tax. How bout you?” 3 hours ago
*de-friends*
Hmph!
@Me fail english?,
hee-hee!!!
You almost had it right…only that I don’t have Facebook…
@miss t-lee, welcome to the club.
Might make a fan page for the blog, but I have no interest in a personal one. Mamafluck a Facebook and the over-obsession and gushing about it.
@Me fail english?,
i’m MAD that my e-triplet isn’t my friend on FB
HMPH!!!!
*pouts and folds arms in the huffiest of HUFFS**
@blackberry molasses,
I’ve been avoiding Facebook like the Swine Flu.
Maybe one day I’ll break down but I’m just not there yet…lol
In the event, I give in though, you’ll be friended–trust and believe.
@miss t-lee,
like Swine Flu, you can’t avoid FB. its a PANDEMIC now!
@ blackberry molasses
I’ve been doing a dayum good job of avoiding both…lol
@Me fail english?,
LOL
@Me fail english?, LMAO, i hate those people!
@miss t-lee,
“*goes back to basking in her post Maxwell concert glow.*”
*fuming with green*
@Cheekie,
He looked good too….lol
Plus, he’s flexible.
*fans self*
@miss t-lee,
*puts Kelis wig on*
I. hate. you. so much right now….AHHHHHHH!
@Cheekie,
@miss t-lee,
Seriously: I’m glad you had fun, though!
I need to see him live…I won’t feel complete until I do. I am positive his voice makes folks’ souls experience The Big O.
@ Cheekie,
Close…lol!!
@miss t-lee, maxwell and idris elba are fighting over me in my head, i think idris is winning though.
Both! I think that I have seen people do both. A lot of people appear to be very confident and in charge. But when you get past that, they are scared 6 year olds. I think this is why, in the end, they fall in love harder than those who don’t seem as confident.
@Hostess, I’m that scared 6 year old. sad but true.
“Twentysomethings . . . also expect partners who have the moral fortitude of Nelson Mandela, the comedic timing of Stephen Colbert, the abs of Hugh Jackman, and the hair of Patrick Dempsey.”
I’m soooo close. If only it said, “the hair of Patrick Ewing.”
Anyway, in the last three paragraphs you address three different issues. Most of the article and the third to last paragraph, whether we expect too much and we’re setting ourselves up for disappointment (and why). The second to last paragraph, whether we’ve become disenchanted with the ridiculous number of divorces/etc. amongst our parents’ generation and even the high number of starter marriages that make it very likely that you know a 30-something divorcee. And the last paragraph which asks is it better to be a conceited @sshole who thrives off that, or come to grips with your issues and be forever frozen by your insecurity.
I tried to answer each, but it’s honestly beyond me. I only know what I do, and I barely know why I do that. All I know is I am looking for someone who could legitimately be in a music video and is painfully sweet/sincere (I’ll let you know when I find a single woman like that), that I’ve lost faith in the institution of marriage, that I can’t stand c*cky @ssholes OR pushovers, and that I’m happy that I’m a guy because I just need to figure sh*t out by the time I’m 40 to still do the family thing.
@An Island,
I’m happy that I’m a guy because I just need to figure sh*t out by the time I’m 40 to still do the family thing.
40? sh*t, you could probably add 20 years to that number
@The Champ,
True, but I don’t like the idea of my son/daughter pouring out a little liquor for me on their 21st birthday.
@An Island, LMBAO. excellent point.
selfishness n the end will sabotage the selfish……… and major co-signage to all who have peeped out MASSIVE ego’s are often a defense mechanism and a way to mask deep seated insecurities…..
Extremes are never good whether it be the low end (ATCQ) LOL or the high….. a BALANCED outlook inward, however is good and a healthier look all around!
@OrangeStar616,
“Extremes are never good”
lol, someone should have told that to pebblez da model.
***google her at your own risk (of being aroused, disgusted, or fired)***
Nothing’s wrong with stroking your own ego a lil’ bit…just know that it feels better when someone else does it for you.
@Monk,
What a lovely euphemism for something else.
@Cheekie,
“I be STROKIN’/ That’s what I be doin’…I STROKE it to the east/ I STROKE it to the west….”
Gotta luv some “Cla’ence Caahter, Cla’ence Caahter, Cla’ence Caahter” (Clarence Carter)
@Me fail english?,
OMG…
You are made of glory, my dear.
@Me fail english?,
me love, Me fail
@Me fail english?,
“Strokin’” ain’t got ish on “Patches”…lol
@Me fail english?, i love you, i do.
someone stated above we tend to take things in extremes.. as I read the comments I notice a lot of people using the problems with low self esteem as a rebuttal. I dont think anyone is arguing that low self esteem doesnt carry its on set of problems, as This may concern you states..
“You shouldn’t be a doormat, but you also shouldn’t be on a pedestal. Just stand up and walk upright with some confidence, and you’ll run into what you’re looking for,”
The article is simply discussing the problems as associated with kanye type self confidence and entitlement not saying…. you should have no self confidence and never be concerned about your self and your needs… or at least I didnt get that from what I read.
@shay_d_lady,
I think the comments you’re talking about are addressing this quote from Twenge:
“There is no evidence that people with very high self-esteem are any better in a relationship than people with low self-esteem.”
Folks are calling shenanigans and I’m inclined to agree.
@Me fail english?,
“Folks are calling shenanigans and I’m inclined to agree.”
with the quote or the people?
@The Champ,
I think people (myself included) don’t believe in the veracity of the quote. See Kamakula’s post
@Me fail english?, There is no evidence that people with very high self-esteem are any better in a relationship than people with low self-esteem.”
, but in saying that you are saying that people with overly high self esteem have the same problems with relationship as people with low self esteem (which means that overly high self esteem does cause problems), which I am in total agreement with. That being said, the article doesnt claim this is not true, its just concentrating on the overly high self esteem part of the equation.
@shay_d_lady,
exactly there is nothing wrong with being confident, nothing at all its a beautiful thing and necessary….matter fact one can be confident yet humble..thats the best kind, the kind that is MAJOR yet quiet, you know its there, but it isn’t boastful yet it can fill up a room, that kind is rooted in something higher than ourselves, time tested, and truer!!!
First off, I paused on the title:
“link of the week: its too big, its too wide…”
My coworker went on this rant about how inappropriate it was that Beyonce was singing about “it’s too big, it’s too wide”…ya know, all double-entendre like. She was all, “How she sound talmbout ‘it’s too biiiiiig, it’s too wiiiiide’ and how they shouldn’t have had her singing that. I was rollin’ (on the river).
“is this selfishness self-sabotaging ourselves, or is this conceitedness crucial to surviving now? (or both?) the carpet’s yours and sh*t.”
Speaking of women, specifically, I think it’s an interesting aspect of the whole “independant woman” dynamic. Since ladies mostly have to fend for themselves lately, it’s only natural that selfishness and the egocentric bighead result from that. And when a woman got her own, of course she got a reason to be at least a bit conceited.
However.
Humble pie is good for the soul and it doesn’t go straight to your thunder thighs. Don’t let that ego blow up too much, because best believe, it will blow up in your face.
@Cheekie,
lol, beyonce has never been once for much subtlety. double-entendres aren’t supposed to immediately stand out like triple e’s.
@The Champ,
Well, if “it” is too big and too wide, then she don’t have anything to be self-inflated about.
What Naturally Alise said above^^. I mean, if you have to resort to excessive vanity or hyper inflated self-centerdness to survive a relationship (job, marriage etc.) then you’re probably with someone who you need to prove to that you are worth something, or you’re getting your rocks off from showing someone else how absolutely amazingly, astonishingly and astoundingly awesome you are. Both sound unhealthy and dam.n tedious to me. The demand for constant obeisance, homage, reverence and small animal sacrifices to constantly feed an already bloated ego must get old after a while and that’s not a way that I would want to live… I also don’t believe that good and absolute self love/ self worth/ self esteem are ever going to be a detriment to a good relationship.
@Wanjiru,
good comment, and i appreciate the effort to circumvent moderation by putting that period in “damn”, lol. that was cute.
Since I survived a relationship with one of the biggest egomaniacs on the East Coast, I feel 100% qualified to speak on the subject! Ego can kill a relationship good and dead. Although I wouldn’t want to date a guy with low-self esteem, and I do like a man with confidence, there is such a thing as too much confidence.
After a while, that kind of relationship can make you feel like you don’t measure up to their high standards. The two of you are always in some sort of silent competition, which is never good for a relationship. I also agree that inflated self-worth is really just a mask to hide insecurities.
@Dom,
Since I survived a relationship with one of the biggest egomaniacs on the East Coast, I feel 100% qualified to speak on the subject!
you dated overit??? i didnt know you were a lesbian
@The Champ,
Champ, you leave my e-chirruns ALONE!
@blackberry molasses, thanks mommy!
@The Champ,
: / Not funny.
@The Champ, know deez.
Self esteem can be a good or bad thing. For example, I thought I had been on this site long enough and had enough clout that Champ, P and Liz would have given me a mobile version of VSB by now. Sadly, I was mistaken. RIP ego.
On top of that, I’ve just spent the last hour tryin to scroll down on this joint to read yall stuff and make a comment! Don’t laugh!! It could happen to you!! Lawd ham mercy….
@nia,
ask and you shall receive.
or not
If you are a person who is very self confident then it will radiate for everyone to see. So my question is who’s to say you are TOO SELF CONFIDENT? If you are a self confident person who stands next to a person full of insecurity then more than likely that person will judge you. Should I dim my light to make them feel OK….me thinks not!!
I am almost 37 (July 20th…Cancer & my name is Larry!!) and it took me a long time to get where I am in terms of self love and being confident. For many years I relied heavily on what people thought of me. I let people control everything from the way I walked to my personal style. Some of this was regular peer pressure & the rest was just not being taught how to be self aware and live my life for me.
It took me many many years to get to where I am today. I used to be one of those women that couldn’t take a compliment. Today..I totally AGREE with all compliments. If that makes OTHERS THINK I am self centered then so be it!! The truth is that I am far from being shallow. My list of attributes is long: loving mother, professional, smart, beautiful, strong, compassionate, sincere, resourceful, etc. So why shouldn’t I look for certain people to share my life with? My friends are self confident, dynamic & uplifting. When we walk in a room it shows!! Not because of clothing or anything like that & HELL WE ARE FAR FROM THE FINEST WOMEN IN THE SPOT! I just think that what we have inside shows.
As far as mate selection, I guess I am picky because I am no longer just giving what I have to offer away. I am good a$$ woman & deserve a good a$$ man to compliment what I have going on.
@Yaa,
“I am no longer just giving what I have to offer away”
Good. Cuz this is the leading cause of “Bitter Betch Syndrome”. Show me an angry asz woman, and I’ll show you a woman a gave too much, too soon to the wrong folks.
It’s like my Daddy says (not really his quote but eff it. He still be sayin’ it tho!): You gotta know when to hold ‘em/Know when to fold ‘em/Know when to walk away/Know when to run”
@Me fail english?,
Is your Daddy Kenny Rogers? lol
@miss t-lee,
No, but he thinks he is. He makes the chicken and everything.
@Yaa,
“July 20th…Cancer & my name is Larry!!)”
*singing* Float, Float on…
@Yaa,
Amen and Hallelujah to this whole effing post.
There’s nothing wrong with being self-love/confidence, even the Bible says you should love your self (“love your neighbor as you love yourself” and “a man is to love his wife as he would himself for what man has ever hated his own flesh..”). I think either arrogance or lack of self love is really the root of most people’s problem. If a person loves them self they won’t harm others (self love should make a person not want to end up in jail for harming someone else without their life being in danger). I do think too many people mistake confidence with arrogance though. When your confident you like yourself and feel you are just as good as everyone else. When you are arrogant you feel you are better than other people (and 99% of the time it is without any good reason). A confident person has their opinions but is reasonable and listens to other peoples thoughts. An arrogant person thinks they know everything and “you can’t tell them nothing”. Personally I need to work on confidence but these thoughts are from what I observe.
@pinksghetti,
I do think too many people mistake confidence with arrogance though
Pretty much. Confidence is a whole different animal than Arrogance is.
@Sula,
Yep, it’s too many folks confusing the two.
@pinksghetti,
I agree! And I’d go so far to say that, if a person shows any sign of loving herself, it’ll be mistaken for conceit MOST of the time. Why? Because most people aren’t close enough to know how special you are. No Hallmark bullish. I really believe that.
@Me fail english?,
“And I’d go so far to say that, if a person shows any sign of loving herself, it’ll be mistaken for conceit MOST of the time. Why? Because most people aren’t close enough to know how special you are.”
I totally agree. Also some people with low-self esteem feel uncomfortable or jealous of people with high self-esteem (not to be mistaken for arrogance). Another thing it may be that someone feels that person doesn’t deserve to feel good about themself (they don’t look like the “ideal” beauty/handsome).
There’s nothing wrong with being a little selfish…not at all. More often than not, you will encounter people who are all about taking, never giving. After a while, that is extremely draining to say the least. It’s important to keep some of us for ourselves, because at the end of the day WE ALL WE GOT!! Eventually, we all discover how much of ourselves to give without resenting it, especially in rel’ships. Knowing that balance is key.
Now extreme selfishness and zero selflessness is just awful…having that attitude is a really good way to alienate yourself from everyone. Nobody likes an a$$hole…it’s not a good look.
@This Just In…,
“More often than not, you will encounter people who are all about taking, never giving. After a while, that is extremely draining to say the least.”
This is true. When dealing with these people you end up having a defense mechanism to protect yourself against their selfishness. You shouldn’t have to do that in a relationship.
@Humble_One,
ahh BALANCE is key once again…. its all about the give AND take in all relationships!!
The idea that one is either too self-confident or has low self-esteem is a bit ridiculous in my opinion. Why didn’t the study talk to people with a normal sense of self/confidence and see how they compare to the low self-esteem set?
I don’t know, it just sounds like an easy way out that these
lazy-arsejournalists take nowadays. “Let’s write a controversial article disclaiming the hype on high self-esteem and see what cookie is crumbled and which panties get tied in a bunch”. Next thing you know they are doing the talk-show circuits and peddling their “New York Times best-selling” books…I think most of those articles are just too gimmicky to actually hold any valuable information. While a conceited and immature person with an inflated ego is a nightmare, her low self-esteem, living through the eyes of others counterpart is nary a dream ever.
Loving of self is a must to be a good functionning human being period… at least, as far as I am concerned.
@Sula,
Amen! I almost forgot how “black and white” a sensationalist journalist can make a very grey situation appear. And your absolutely correct, even if the data doesn’t bear out the point they wanted to make, some people will purposely overstate a position (John Stossel, I’m looking at you) that even they don’t believe in an effort to be provocative.
@Sula, Loving of self is a must to be a good functionning human being period… at least, as far as I am concerned.
Chuuuch!
@Sula,
“Why didn’t the study talk to people with a normal sense of self/confidence and see how they compare to the low self-esteem set?”
lol, because it didn’t.
@Sula,
Please don’t be creeped out, but…Aaaaawwww your avatar pic is so purrddddyyyy. I’d kill for your cheek bones. Alright, back to regular scheduled programming
@ofloveandotherdemons,
Thanks darling! VSB went ahead and changed the template on me…
Oh well! You live and you learn….
and you change your gravatarQuestion:
Um, so how you gon’ have a big ego while wearing window blinds eyewear? Or do you deserve to have a big ego because you can still rock those with a straight face?
@Cheekie,
BWAHHAHAHbwog[ontew0ihn4qgn[ovso[i’/
iHate that iLove you.
I have personal experience with this. I was in a 5yr relationship with a woman like this. One thing that I have noticed in family, my past relationship, and friend’s relationships is that self-esteem is confused with selfishness. It seems that with every relationship I see it’s men and women that overestimate their value or what they do in the relationship. I don’t understand how people get in relationships with the mindset of “this is who I am and it’s your responsibility to deal with it”. If you are in a relationship and you have never had to compromise or that person lets you do what you want when you feel like it then it is bound to fail.
There is a difference between self-esteem, low-self esteem, and high-self esteem. Most of us need to and should have self esteem. Low-self esteem short changes yourself and high-self esteem means your an egotistical bas***d. I’ve met too many women that are looking for more of an “employee” than a mate. It all boils down to selfishness. I think people get settling confused with being realistic.
@Humble_One, I’ll disagree on this point:
high-self esteem means your an egotistical bas***d
I may have interpreted what u are saying the wrong way, but I don’t think there’s anything wrong with having high self-esteem. I think we all should actually have high self-esteem, but the trick is being able to respect and relate to others. If everyone had high self-esteem and knew how to interact with other people with care, compassion, empathy and respect (and be able to differentiate what these emotions are versus what being a doormat is, or what taking kindness for weakness is and being a parasite or a bully) then we would be ok. The problem is that we lack a lot of emotional intelligence because it’s not been what’s traditionally been respected in our culture, and wisdom hasn’t been passed down generationally most times.
@pgh muse,
I understand what you are saying as having self-esteem. So it’s either you have low or high self-esteem? To me if you have low self-esteem you don’t have any
@Humble_One, To me if you have low self-esteem you don’t have any
Well, someone can see themselves negatively, or in a negative inferior light and this may cause them to shuck and jive, or ho themselves out, or all kinds of other behaviors that manifest because of a negative sense of worth. I think if you think highly of yourself you will treat yourself well and demand it from other people. I’ll also reiterate that the trick is to also recognize the worth and value of other people around u and acting accordingly
@Humble_One, wait – I got what u are saying and. I think I agree, i think I got lost in the semantics
@pgh muse,
emotional intelligence because it’s not been what’s traditionally been respected in our culture
That is very, very true. I remember having my first taste of reality shows (competition) by watching The Apprentice… I was appalled at how when people took the blame and responsibility for things going wrong, they were the ones paying for it. I was like why are we rewarding the a$$holes again? This is the way Corporate America works, so that’s what is taught to children in schools and social settings early on…
Now it would be highly hypocritical to ask them to turn around and be completely different when it comes to relationships…. actually, they just won’t be emotionally mature enough to even understand what it means to take one for the team!
@Sula,
That always bothered me about the Donald and his ilk. Matter of fact…I don’t give a damn about Trump. I just find it unsettling that people are actually conditioning young people that what’s acceptable/appropriate in certain corporate cultures is something to aspire to. And if you can’t get with it you’re some kinda hippie, liberal freak.
I blame the quasi-capitalist vultures for making impressionable young rappers believe that as long as they attain wealth, nothing else they do can come into question. Them…and Jim Jones (where’s Pan-Pan today?)
Whose quote is that “Where success takes you, character will not sustain you.” I kept thinking about that during the Obama election. THAT’S what really intrigued me about the race. A black man making it to the highest office: phenomenal. A man of unabiding principle making it: I wish I had the facility with language to adequately express it. I’ll just say, “Damn”.
@Sula & pgh muse,
” I was appalled at how when people took the blame and responsibility for things going wrong, they were the ones paying for it. I was like why are we rewarding the a$$holes again? This is the way Corporate America works, so that’s what is taught to children in schools and social settings early on…
Now it would be highly hypocritical to ask them to turn around and be completely different when it comes to relationships…. actually, they just won’t be emotionally mature enough to even understand what it means to take one for the team!”
I agree 100%. I thought I was the only one that used the word “emotionally mature”. There is nothing wrong with taking one for the team. Thats why you get all the fakeness, back-stabbing, @ss kissing, bus throwing under, non-responsible accepting mofos rising up in the ranks in Corporate America. No one is apologetic for who they are. Fine, but accept what comes along for being who you are. It is one thing to ask for respect from other people. It is another to think so highly of yourself that you feel you have to compromise only if it’s within your convenience. Which I am not sure if that is actually compromising?
Good Post Im having this battle right now.
Im 28 so Im tryna settle down but it seems like Im looking for a perfect woman that doesnt exist (my friends say this all the time i dont believe um). Maybe I am picky but I know that I wont be happy with anything less than what I want. Throughout the years I have learned to compromise but I know exactly what I dont want. its weird i dunno I want more kids too my biological clock is tickkin like a mugg. I wanna knock sumthin up real bad but im smarter than that but wheneva I find a chick that is 90% perfect im puttin all the chips on the table.
@BLUNTBLAZER,
wheneva I find a chick that is 90% perfect im puttin all the chips on the table.
Good for you Senor de la Blunt lol.
@pgh muse,
sometimes i think that chick is a unicorn/4 leaf clover/lepracaun that doesnt exist.
@BLUNTBLAZER,
Good stuff. I think my settling when I was young for a decent dude who was really into me, rather than going for what I actually like is what made me so anti-settle now. That shet is a huge waste of time and I found myself wishing I was single the whole time. Even when I got lonely and wanted A rel’ship, I was happier to be alone than with someone I didn’t feel strongly about.
@Me fail english?,
my sons mom ruined it for me I trusted/loved that chick but she took my kindness for weakness but after i she magically had an epihany and wanted me back. but too late she got evicted from my mind. no 30 day notice. It didnt turn me sour tho I still believe in picket fences 2 car garages dog yadadadada
@BLUNTBLAZER,
I think an accurate question should be why do you want to settle down? Because you’re 28? Because you want more kids?
I would say why don’t you just wait until you find a person that you want to settle down with? In the meanwhile, buy louder speakers to quiet the ticking clock (I had to resort to that myself…
)
@Sula, my clock only clicks certain times of the month.
and when i walk past a playground.
and when i take my little cousins out.
and at baby showers
and weddings
and bbqs
and in the shower
and…and…i just luh da kids.
@Sula,
I wanna settle down cause I wanna be married by 30. Im ready to do the whole family thang i been ready since I was 23. I already have a kid tho so Im smarter now and my next time im doin it the right way marriage and all that. Never wanted to be a really old dad i wanna be able to throw the football around. Plus i neva saw my gradpas but my son has I want my kids to have more than i did.
@BLUNTBLAZER, I wanna knock sumthin up real bad
*blink*
@overit?,
lol yea that came out wrong but yea its a sad but true statement. My ex wanted me to hella bad but I neva did cause she was a 80%’r and I need 90% compababilty and up. Like my boy the jacka said in his song gotta be “compatible with the black radical”
high self esteem and loving yourself is GOOD, you need to feel good about yourself, value and love yourself, being fully confident in who you are…
low self esteem, not feeling good about yourself, having NO confidence is bad
being an arrogant selfish jerk, in the form of ITS ALLLLLLLLL ABOUT you, and your needs being met etc with little to zero regard for others and their needs and feelings is BAD……
HUGE super gigantic out of control ego’s are bad
did I miss anything????