I’m in the process of recreating some compilation CD’s I lost to some crackhead in a dice game. I’m an avid music lover so how hard can it be to put together some compilation CD’s? Not hard right?
Hmmm….
Well one particular CD I’m attempting to put together in my series (Panama Jackson Presents…My Mama’s Music-I already have 2 volumes and a Get Tha Draws CD done) is an attempt at compiling some of the greatest love songs of all time. But I’m adding a twist to it; I want to go from decade to decade, from the doo-wop era (a la The Flamingos-I Only Have Eyes For You) to current day. Sounds simple right???
Wrong.
Apparently, quality love songs quit being made somewhere in the early to mid-nineties. You know what this means right?
Somebody jacked quality R&B! Yes people, somebody stole R&B from us and replaced it with crap like Akon. And I like The-Dream as much as the next guy, but he’s quite ghetto and I don’t think those songs will stand the test of time. It’s like everything is pop music nowadays. We just don’t get that real singing a** R&B/soul music that we used to have. Has anybody seen: Peaches & Herb, EWF, Frankie Beverly and Maze, New Edition, Jodeci (though they got REAL ghetto on us), Mint Condition, Silkk, etc.
They’re gone.
Pretty much, Ne-yo and Plies are the only people putting out that real R&B.
If you think about it, over the past ten to fifteen years, we have been inundated with music that is just bad. Now it’s wholly possible that the changing musical landscape is perfectly mirroring the changing relationship landscape. Women are more indepedent and taking less guff from men so perhaps women’s ascension is causing men to go into b*tch mode., turning a lot of men into, well, p*ssies. So the music is now reflecting that. That and trickin’. Me no know.
When I have to stop at Boyz II Men’s II as the last good R&B album and the sh*t came out in 1994…Houston we have a problem. When will the bullsh*t end. I’m not even sure what to call what they are doing nowadays. It’s not R&B, so what is it? Rap-sanging?
I blame Jim Jones and R. Kelly.
And let’s add to this equation two more occurrences: the growth of “neo-soul” and the decrease in actual love songs. Let’s start with the love songs first. Is it just me or is everybody talking about all the pain they’ve experienced. It’s like nobody is happy anymore. F*ck government studies, we have our statistics right here in black music. It’s damn near rare to find a song nowadays in mainstream R&B about a happy couple. Everybody is either gettin’ beat down, cheated on, lied to, or is just plain unhappy and trying to figure out how to leave their person. It’s no wonder why there aren’t any successful marriages anymore. NOBODY LIKES EACHOTHER. People used to sing songs about being dumb in love, ya know, “Always Be My Baby” type songs.
Nobody is happy anymore. No dude is going to cry for his chick anymore. Or at least he isn’t going to admit it on record. Or its going to be mashed up with some kind of ghetto message.
And I’m sure a lot of people would say to just go to neo-soul for the good music fix. And sometimes that works. But I want R&B, not pseudo-deep music. I want the Johnny Gill style albums back. I don’t need to hear about society and personal reflection about how water makes me feel love for another person. Dammit, can’t you just give me straightforward love songs anymore? Where is the love? Where is the love???
Where are the Alexander O’Neals? The Babyface’s? The Guys? What the hell happened?
Basically, I want the good ole R&B of yesteryear, not the uber-I’m so hood-style rap sanging music. And I don’t want to hear about how deep love is if it has to be compared to tree bark and the pitter patter of the faucet dripping into my sink. Bump that, tell me about love…tell me about love.
R&B is missing. Somebody stole it. So I’m asking you…
…have you seen my R&B? And why do you think the music has taken such a turn from the soul music of yesteryear?
-VSB P aka THE ARSONIST aka TANGLE JIG P aka GIIIIIIIIIIIRL, HE A 3
Related posts:
{ 201 comments… read them below or add one }
You said it: Folks aren’t happy anymore. They have issues with everything. Even if they feel happy, they are quick to find something to be pissed about. I suggest Lexapro!
@Ms. Smart, now there you go advertising again.
i suppose that’s better than there you go telling me no again.
keif.
@Panama Jackson, I don’t sell Lexapro. I just hear it’s a pretty decent drug.
@Ms. Smart, i think depression actually helps craft better love songs. look at phyllis (bad example?) so, maybe the artists should go to anger management counseling and have the anti-depression medication withheld from them. that’s just my twisted opinion.
Some Of The Thangs That Killed R&B:
–Boy Bands
–The Neptunes (aka The Nigg@ and The Innovator…you can figure out who’s who in that crew)
–The first generation that never heard a R&B song WITHOUT a rapper doing the hook started buying music. (Seriously, you want to mess up anybody, under the age of 30′s day, play Earth Wind & Fire’s REASONS and watch them slowly go insane as they wait for the part where Akon, Chamillionaire or some other twit would come in with their hastly scribbled on a note pad in the recording studio “rap” that has NOTHING to do with the song and barely makes any sense, would throw in their crap take.
@T. Troy Stewart,
Seriously, one of the saddest days of my life was when I was in the spot and MTume came on and half the crowd stopped dancing when they didn’t hear Biggie. Heavy Sigh…
P.S. 3Ts are touring right now with EnVogue & Silk or Shai or sumthin
@bittersweet’s baby, stop. for real? *stopped* dancing? dang…that is sad.
@Miss Patterson,
Scattered like I do when the Reggae set begins. Can’t have lotsa body and be safe on the floor during that 30 mins
@bittersweet’s baby, Hardly a suprise though.. if you going to be real Juicy > Juicy fruit. Everyone should know all the words to that track, it’s possibly the most universally loved rap song…..evar.
What happened isn’t the same as people being dissapointed when Between The Sheets is on instead of Big Poppa. Now that would be a travesty.
@Dangerous,
I’m not surprised by this either. A good (or even decent DJ) would’ve possibly mixed the two records so the crowd could have the best of both worlds with “Juicy Fruit” and “Juicy”.
I’ve always wondered what did the term “juicy” have to do with the lyrics to “Juicy”. Is juicy the adjective of the slang word “juice” as in respect?
@Monk,
I’ve always thought he was tyrna pay homage – and give fools a heavy hint to refer back to Juicy Fruit. But that’s a clever mutation of the meaning.
@bittersweet’s baby, that was always my assumption too.
@bittersweet’s baby,
I’m glad it didn’t catch on to th point where n*ggas would be walkin’ around talkin’ ’bout, “I’m so juicy.” That would have a whole ‘nother meaning.
@T. Troy Stewart, under the age of 30’s day, play Earth Wind & Fire’s REASONS
HEY! I take offense to that! I’m still under 30 for another 16 days lol.
@pgh muse,
Co-sign, how bout I got a few more years and 16 days before I hit 30 and I LOVE reasons…oh and btw I stan for kool and the gang and Gap band…among others..Im VERY offended..but yuor statement definitely applies to the under 21 crowd.
@pgh muse,
I take offense cuz I’m under 30 for another 3 years…and “Reasons” is my favorite EW&F song!
*Hmph*
@T. Troy Stewart, Or when they realize “I call Your Name” isn’t turning out to be “Throw Some D’s”! SMH…poor kids…I had to argue my nephew down about Mario sampling Biz Markie
@Smiley Face, and the original Biz Markie song is horrible with horrible singing.
@Dangerous, didn’t say it wasn’t lol
@Dangerous, Biz Markie’s song was horribly good. Like so horrible it went all the way to the other side of the spectrum and now its good. Today’s music is just getting stuck in the horribly bad section
@Smiley Face,
You sound like me fighting with my 15 year old nephew about how that new song he’s listening too is really an old song…lol
@miss t-lee, girl…they don’t know, lol..we’ve got to school ‘em lol!
@Smiley Face,
It’s sad because I’m almost positive my Dad said the same thing to me back in the day.
Full circle like a mofo!!!
@miss t-lee,
LMAO I know that’s right!
@T. Troy Stewart, –The Neptunes (aka The Nigg@ and The Innovator…you can figure out who’s who in that crew)
i actually think that Neptunes did a good job with their R&Bness. hell they produced for SWV (“use your heart”) and even their songs on JT’s first album were good and R&B.
plus they crafted the greatest R&B song of all time, “superthug”
@Panama Jackson, JT’s first album were good and R&B.
I agree. It was a neptunes produced single that made me cop that. forget which one probably the first… but it was HOT at the time.
another thing, somebody decided that Jam & Lewis couldn’t produce anymore, Raphael Saddig won’t bring Tony, Tone, Toni back cuz he’s too busy chasing young British 2520 Betty Wright stunt doubles, Timbaland went Pop, Justin Timberlake think he’s Soul…wasn’t enough GOOD neo-soul artists, D’Angelo took too long to make his follow up CD and, most importantly, too many old cats like me running around who remember when you could make a mix tape that would make panties melt like butta, baby and will jump anybody who tries to make an honest attempt at making some good music (like Leela James who I’ve seen get roasted lately because she “dared” to remake a Womack & Womack classic, Baby, I’m Scared Of You…I come to the conclusion that she’s only getting hated on because she looks good with black hair and tight jeans…)
T. Troy Stewart is telling the gospel.
I miss Jam & Lewis on the track, Babyface on the track, Kashif, David Frank, Patrick Leonard, Angela Winbush…even new jack swing production. They used to come with tracks that make the hairs on your neck raise up.
But I liked Neptunes production on Kelis’s albums…she was their “home base” act like Gang Starr was Premier’s. I thought Pharrell would have been a good fit for Janet at one point, to get a good 80s feel.
@Stuff Ghetto People Like, i agree. i think folks kept going to pharrell for a certain sound b/c it was selling, but every now and then when you hear the NERD stuff or non-singles on albums produced and written by the neptunes, they will surprise you with how well versed they are in standard r&b
@T. Troy Stewart, dang…you just reminded me about the Instant Village album. Raphael Siddiq brought it. Why didn’t that album do better than it did? I also think videos killed R&B too. If you can’t bring the image, you can’t sell the album. And as a tradition I think most artists who are focused on quality aren’t necessarily stuck on their selling image, unless they have the right stylists who can worry about that stuff for them. no money=no mtv time=no record sales.
As a result, artists like Zhane were forced to come out with a video to “Hey Mr. DJ” instead of “La La La” or any of their other slow joints. Then there are some like [i forgot her name] that didn’t have the PR or A&R or whatever to get the album out to the masses. I hope I remember her name in the morning. (ha! that last sentence sounded like a bad guy joke.) I’d also like to argue that if Monica had the better voice. Brandy just had money and producers. Her voice couldn’t compete with Monica’s. I’m sure that this has been argued by many a Black folk, but I right.
@Miss Patterson,
Girl, Instant Vintage was def an instant CLASSIC! “You Should Be Here” is the bizness… mmmhmmm
@Miss Patterson, i, too, wondered why instant vintage didn’t do better than it did. then again, it wasn’t an album intended to sell records like el Tonys. i mean, it didn’t really have any “commercial” songs on it that would appeal to a mass audience. “be here” tried…
and clearly Monica had the better voice, and her boy is mine album was dope, and actually sold around 3 million copies. monica was selling units. until she started dating c-murder
@Panama Jackson,
Being with Rocko didn’t help either.
@T. Troy Stewart, Whhaaatt?! CHUUCH!!
yeah, i complain about this all the time. r&b died. as a result, my itunes collection looks like it should belong to someone who went deaf around 1996. it’s sad, man. like my brother always says “even stevie wonder is a caricature of himself.”
maybe artists/songwriters these days don’t really know love anymore. think about it. maybe the dynamics have changed so much so that people only know about quickies, one-nighters and freaknic flashbacks. it’s possible that r&b died because the songwriters aren’t falling in love anymore. stevie, donny, roberta, patrice and phyllis, etc. KNEW heartache.
the thing is, i wish someone would come out with quality r&b because as much as i love my old r&b i have a story attached to each and everyone of those lyrics. maybe i should create my own mix…hmm, good idea arsonist.
@Miss Patterson, it’s possible that r&b died because the songwriters aren’t falling in love anymore. stevie, donny, roberta, patrice and phyllis, etc. KNEW heartache.
you know, i dont know that they knew heartache any moroe than anybody today. i think the music bizness is different. those folks were making albums, with the possible exception of patrice rushen who was definitely aiming for singles, and nowadays folks are all about getting a hit single and making the catchiest possible song ever.
i will, say that though i think in general, most of that music from prior times was better, a lot of times i do suffer from revisionist history and stamp something as better b/c its older. there was PLENTY of non-sense back in the 60s and 70s. i have hard drives full of terrible albums with horribly written songs. they just didnt all make radio. now, the worst but catchiest songs hit the radio and get made into big hits.
except, LOL Smiley Face. that’s just great.
@Panama Jackson,
“except, LOL Smiley Face. that’s just great.”
every time you say this I’m like “why he talking about me?” lol
@Panama Jackson,
the music bizness is different. those folks were making albums, with the possible exception of patrice rushen who was definitely aiming for singles, and nowadays folks are all about getting a hit single and making the catchiest possible song ever.
That’s what I think too. The average artist would make a package that had a theme…but they had thrown in their formula crap too. The end of side 1 was more often than not some token slow ballad on an otherwise upbeat dance/funk album. Nowadays it at least seems to be almost all formula…nothing sounds “arrived at”…but more like ninjas are in search of some one-hit wondery sh*t to blow up with. Or in the case of so-called neo soul, fools will try to sound like what they think the 70s sound was and miss by a country mile.
People aren’t lovin on each other like they used to. It used to be after a long day at work you wanna come home and chill with ya man or woman..now everyone is hella selfish. You can find some good R&B on myspace or ask around.
@MizThickaDenThick,
“You can find some good R&B on myspace..”
This is funny, but very true.
@MizThickaDenThick, you’re probably right about myspace. but then i’ll have the same problems A&Rs have…spend hours sifting thru non-sense to find one gem.
plus, i deleted my myspace pages.
Here are some reasons:
Quality died with the real music critic. Let’s face it, some folk need to be hated on to the point of finding another profession.
There’s a lack of church/classicaly trained singers doing R&B. What’s left are these whiny, nasaly, out of breath chicks trying to put on a show.
R&B n*ggas went from thug to homo-thug.
Two words: NO BASS! It’s almost wrong to even talk in a deep voice these days, let alone sing with any amount of it.
@Maximillian, yo ain’t never lied, Maxy!
@Maximillian,
great points
@Maximillian, Quality died with the real music critic. Let’s face it, some folk need to be hated on to the point of finding another profession.
this is an extremely interesting point which coincides with the rise of the “you’re just a hater” mentality. let’s be real, there’s NO way that r. kelly’s later catalog should be top selling. especially if it makes it to radio then all of a sudden people assume its good, b/c its on the radio. its to the point where people don’t think stuff is worth listening to UNLESS it’s getting radio play.
plus this stuff nowadays will not stand the test of time. there’s a reason why 12 play is still r.kelly’s most heralded album. it didn’t include gorilla’s, kitchens, gay lovers, masks, or thoia thongs.
@Maximillian,
YES.
Especially the no bass part. The f*ck? The ‘men’ don’t sound like men singing to me. What woman worth her salt wants to be serenaded by someone who sounds like her baby brother?
@Maximillian,
There’s a lack of church/classicaly trained singers doing R&B. What’s left are these whiny, nasaly, out of breath chicks trying to put on a show.
Two words: NO BASS! It’s almost wrong to even talk in a deep voice these days, let alone sing with any amount of it.
A theory was thrown around once that too many dudes of today grew up tryna emulate Michael Jackson’s vocal tone. And a lot of these females aren’t singers in that classic sense the R&B fan expects, but vocalists (think the lead of a rock band) put on due to sex appeal. Basically video vixens harmonizing. Worse than what went down in Hustle & Flow.
But it’s OK IMO to be a vocalist as opposed to this super strong singer. It’s like a rapper just giving a mic check with no main topic…sometimes it’s a better sound for someone to just ice the cake of the beat with their voice communicating an idea instead of searching for a bunch of notes to hit and show off with.
It’s just a shame that the people with better singing ability and ideas to match are too often being snubbed in favor of some 18 year old who can get a few good pics into King magazine.
@Maximillian,
For True! I’m too weary to go in like I wanna but the first point about the lack of critics… Folks are HYPERSENSITIVE these days and it’s a crime to tell em the truth about the level (or lack) of talent. Look at American Idol. It’s not all for ratings, because how do they make it that far in the first place? Cuz their mamas nem, cousins nem, best friends nem didn’t tell them the cold, hard truth. There’s nothing wrong with an unbiased critique but it’ll never be well received if people don’t learn how to deal with disappointments early on. Find your true strength and go with that…
I hate this post because it is 99% true. I do have one question, are we limiting this to just Black folk?
Anyway, I think it is still out there, just lurking in the depths of the underground because people don’t want to hear it anymore. We would much rather listen to Plies, Drake, the Dream (ugh, I loathe him) and others who forgot what it really means to create a beautiful love ballad.
But I did notice that for every bad CD I find at least one or two beautiful love songs… (Usher, Beyonce, A. Keys)
What about Prince? Duffy? Raphael Saadiq? Robin Thicke?
I feel where you are coming from though, when you find what you are looking for let me know!
@Buxxy,
“Duffy? ”
That was a great cd.
@Buxxy, I do have one question, are we limiting this to just Black folk?
no, i think it covers anybody doing r&b. to include the duffys, joss stones, robin thickes, etc.
and generally, i never really loved most of their work. i was prepared to be in love with duffy after reading all these interviews and articles and then i was like…that’s it? that’s the album?
van damme.
@Buxxy, Drake’s “Sooner Than Later” is serviceable make love music. Would have been a perfect song if he left some of the “rap sh*t” out if it (“N*gga, nice going”).
He can make really strong music if he’d avoid a lot of that dumb sh*t too many acts of today can’t resist throwing in (e.g. vulgar language, graphic subject matter, ghetto idiocy).
I MISS R&B!!!!!! I am so late on the new Trey songz, the new whitney, the new letoya cuz while I love r7B none of the new stuff is good anymore. I have to dig in the crates and such to discover old R&B to be happy again.
I am convinced Keyshia Cole stays confused on whether to leave her man and Letoya Luckett stays gettin cheated on, while Trey stays just wantin to get in the draws. It’s sad.
@Liz, Keyshia Cole
I like Keyshia Cole. But her first album was her best.
@Liz, i’ve never been a huge keyshia cole fan. but man, when she comes with a great song, it is just stupendously great. that joint with her and monica is great. i love “heavensent”…
i think i may be a closet fan.
@Liz,
I am convinced Keyshia Cole stays confused on whether to leave her man and Letoya Luckett stays gettin cheated on, while Trey stays just wantin to get in the draws. It’s sad.
You hit on another good issue. The ideas targeted and who they’re targeted to. Female singers whine about adultery and breaking up to chicks who are probably struggling with that. Dudes are singing to girls who find them sexy pandering to get them in the sack or providing the soundtrack for dudes who need an assist getting one in the sack (as guys don’t currently listen to R&B for themselves). R&B can communicate a lot more ideas and issues, but this is the scenario of the vast majority of cuts.
and ANOTHER THING… (i don’t have anything else to say, i just wanted to say that. why are people pretending to be asleep?)
Music has become more about $$$$ cars and 304′s vs. artistry. How many people in the Top 100 on Billboard can actually play an instrument? How many of those same records have live bands backing them? We’re a fast paced superficial society who would rather not read, think independently, or innovate a darn thang. Not all of us but a good deal of us. Its also funny that the amount of ringtones sold is a major deal now.
I admit that I look back more than I look to the present for good music. There are some keepers of the flame, unfortunately they gets no spin. Musiq is always good for some ballads, Teedra Moses, Tamia, Jill Scott, E.Badu, Maxwell, Eric Roberson (when I’m in the mood for him), Dwele (have to be in the mood for him too), Chrisette Michelle, just to name a few. There are local artists everywhere that should get more shine. So its still out there, just not on the charts. I also think Keyshia Cole put out a nice record this last go round.
I do, however, feel sorry for any generation that is after mine. Boyz II Men, Jodeci, Silk, Jade, SWV, TLC, BBD(really any New Edition spin-off as well as the actual group) , Montel Jordan, Troop, Aaliyah, EnVogue, Young Brandy & Monica, DeBarge ( which sometimes gets mixed in with Switch), The Deele, Babyface, After 7. I mean come on . These people put out solid R&B that is still relevant.
This post woke me up when I’m supposed to be falling asleep. Signing off to make my own mix now.
@Nola Darling,
” ….there is only music so that there is new ringtones.” c. Arctic Monkeys.
It kind of seems that way these days, and I agree 10000% on the lack of inovation in most of the music played in main stream media. Although, that could be a by product of complete commercialization of that particular industry rather than lack of talent. There is still a lot of great, interesting, fresh material out there; you just have to dig a little harder to find it.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
Wouldn’t expect to see an Arctic Monkeys fan around here.
@Dangerous, why is that? we have to be more open minded than anybody, so that doesn’t surprise me that we would find people who are fans of different types of music here.
@T. Troy Stewart, Didn’t think Arctic Monkeys had much of a following in the US. Although ofloveandotherdemons hardly equates to a fanbase, you understand what i’m saying!
@Dangerous, I do understand….
@Dangerous, hell, i was surprised too…i motherf*cking LOVE the arctic monkeys.
and i came up on them at a tower records (rip), it was playing in the background, i asked the cashier what it was he said, arctic monkeys, i was like, dope name. i’m sold.
i been bumping that first joint ever since.
plus they have like one of my favorite lines ever:
“put on your dancing shoes, you pretty little swine.”
i tried that as a pickup line once…totally didn’t work.
in truth, everything about thier first album was so perfect from the title, “whatever you say i am, that’s what i’m not” ~ sounds like kanye’s motto, only the exact opposite.
to the sequencing.
my joint is “from the ritz to the rubble”
“last night these two bouncers…”
can you tell i’m a fan?
@Panama Jackson, looool their other albums are good too but not touching the debut.
Highly relatable (is that even a word) album. We’ve all gotten to a stage in a relationship where you can seemingly do no-good & all you can do is reminesce about the good times “but it’s hard to remember that on a day like today, when you’re argumentative & have got the face on.”
Great album!
Some of the Neo-Soul is on target: Rahsaan Patterson, Dwele, Maxwell, Raheem DeVaughn, Jill Scott, Angie Stone and Chrisette Michelle. Or your gonna have to smooth jazz- Will Downing always works. As for pure R&B… let me know when you find it
Where is Mint Condition by the way?
@OneChele, Will Downing’s A DREAM FULFILLED has been in my music rotation since I first bought it on cassette.
@OneChele, I like where your head is but I can only cosign on Dwele, Jill and Chrisette, the others are falling slowly out of my rotation
@OneChele, i read an interesting quip on rap radar the other day from YN (eliot wilson). he said he thinks that that raheem devaughn will be lauded once he’s passed away. i wonder how true that is. right now, i’m not a big fan though i’ll give him credit as being a great singer with a few songs i like.
and there’s only but so much will downing i can take in one sitting.
@Panama Jackson, raheem devaughn
That is interesting. I like Raheem Devaughn.
@pgh muse,
so do I.
@Panama Jackson,
‘and there’s only but so much will downing i can take in one sitting.’
i’m here with you on that…not a fan of his voice, i will tolerate but his voice is scary to me.
@Panama Jackson,
i read an interesting quip on rap radar the other day from YN (eliot wilson). he said he thinks that that raheem devaughn will be lauded once he’s passed away.
To even think on some sh*t like that shows how bankrupt Black music fandom really is. We give great creators all these posthumous props, superficially labeling them “the greatest” when ninjas didn’t give two turds about them in their days of walking the earth.
I was just talking today with a local Hip-Hop radio host who broadcast his last show Sunday. I had to tell him I appreciated not only that he gave local acts a chance to be heard on the radio, but kept alive those 12 inch cuts long forgotten by stations too preoccupied with making sure Tupac, Biggie and others with well-established legacies get heard every hour on the hour.
@OneChele, Mint condition has a new album out now. I think its called E life. I’ve heard one joint on the radio too.
What you know about “Here, My Dear” by Marvin Gaye? I can sing the entire album for anyone who’s interested, this Sunday on Youtube.
Anywho, the whole story behind its making is terribly sad, yet brilliant. Poor Anna Gaye.
@Miss Patterson, OMG…that song always brings sighing tears to my eyes….
@Miss Patterson, from WHEN DID YOU STOP LOVING ME…
You know, when you say your marriage vows, they’re supposed to be for real. I mean…
if you think back about what you really said, you know, about, honor and loving and
obeying till death do us part and all. But it shouldn’t be that way, it should…it
should, it shouldn’t be lies because it turns out to be lies. If you don’t honor what
you said, you lie to God. The words should be changed.
That is some deep ish right there and the entire song is just like you walked in on a couple just putting all their business out there, cringeworthy…and that’s a compliment.
@T. Troy Stewart,
The whole album is cringeworthy.
That was some serious pain.
@T. Troy Stewart, *ms. p picks up the mic*–
oooooooh…now as i recall we tried a million times again and again and again. and that isn’t it all, i gave my love to you each time to make amends. suddenly, i start to realize i can’t make it. pretty birds fly away. i have to leave you for my health sake. what to do? make him pay. for leaving you my fine is to pay forever. so, if a fresh new love comes in I won’t say those words again…
*hands mic back to T. Troy*
@Miss Patterson, poor Anna Gaye????
poor Marvin. LOL.
@Panama Jackson,
poor Marvin only because that brotha had some serious demons (but he was fine back in the day). But Poor Anna, because of his cheatin a$$.
Alicia Keys may be the only…Otherwise, I would try underground artists…there are some good ones floating around I’m sure. Try Kindred the Family Soul. Vivian Green has some heartbreak songs and love songs…she’s awesome. Can’t think of anybody else right now. Maxwell?
@chaoticdiva, though i’m not the biggest kindred fan (i think they’re shows are much better than the studio albums) i will definitely give them credit for trying to keep it alive.
and i think alicia keys is as much pop-hip-hop-r&b as anybody else.
@Panama Jackson,
You cannot tell me that “You Don’t Know My Name” was not keeping the formula. I <3 that song.
I don’t know why R&B has taken on its current mutation, but if its love songs you are looking for I’d suggest checking out the new crop of folk/Americana singers out there. It’s definitely not everyone’s cup of tea but singers and bands like Bon Iver, Band of Horses, Blind Pilot, M. Ward, Jose Gonzalez, Noah and the Whale, Iron and Wine etc, have some really breath- taking beautiful songs. Super honest, non-cliché happy little ditties (plenty of slit your wrist beautiful also, but you asked for happy) about love. Another lovely frontier for love songs that I’ve just discovered and I’m currently exploring is blue grass. Seriously, there is such good stuff out there: Allison Krauss and the Union Station, The Dillards (old school band), Infamous Stringduster….. There plenty of other venues to get your love song fix, if you don’t mind venturing out into other genres. Just my two cents.
@ofloveandotherdemons,
Don’t forget Ray Lamontagne, his “Trouble’ cd stays in my rotation. OOOh and Amos Lee! WHAT! I lurve me some him! You Tube Amos Lee’s I’m not myself..that song took me over some things, lol!
Tangle Jig P-
I blame Jim Jones Are you even cognizant of the fact that you blame JJ for d@mn near errythang?
It’s damn near rare to find a song nowadays in mainstream R&B about a happy couple. People somehow seem more comfortable identifying with angst than foolish love. Honestly, don’t we all know at least three
hundredpeople who hate “happy Mary,” refuse to play anything after Share My World and are still actively tryna get her and K-Ci back together to recycle the formula?Specifically looking for R&B chicks? A few ya gotta luv off top are:
-Vivian Green
-Chrisette Michele
-Leela James*
-Joss Stone *
And diggin Melanie Fiona’s “Give It To Me Right”
*They have old souls as an added bonus
@bittersweet’s baby, hate “happy Mary,” refuse to play anything after Share My World and are still actively tryna get her and K-Ci back together to recycle the formula?
“Mary” is MJB’s best album!!
@pgh muse,
Deep Inside, what?! But they ain’t tryna hear it. One of my girls said the album cover was too plain, so it can’t be good. The
lack oflogic is astounding…@pgh muse, you and I are >here< on "MARY" and two of the producers on that album were Jam & Lewis. I was listening to her her current releases on Soul Squared last night and I'm not quite feeling that Brown Eyed Pop sounding ish.
@bittersweet’s baby, I blame Jim Jones Are you even cognizant of the fact that you blame JJ for d@mn near errythang?
of course. that’s a long running joke b/w the champ and i that predates even VSB. jim jones (at one point) was the biggest hater alive.
@Panama Jackson,
Yeah, I was being facetious. I know you know. You throw him out there so often and randomly, I thought I’d acknowledge it. Besides, I knew him as a hater before I knew his face w/ his name. But I give him more leeway after he broke down on 106th & Park on World AIDS Day a couple years ago. It’s mostly coming from a place of hurt…
Right, so, my age may come out here, but… Yall must not be looking in the right places. What the EFF is wrong with neo-soul? If Old Lovas (Dwele) doesn’t embody everything that old R&B could have positively evolved into… No, you’re NOT going to get the same thing as there was before. Just like the generation you’re holding up isn’t going to be the same thing as before. Whether that’s a bad thing or not depends on the generation.
And as for the new generation not being able to hear an R&B without hooks… I don’t think that’s true. What they WILL probably say is true is that it’s “corny” and that they listen to rap and (even though it’s not true) hip hop. And then there’s the autotuner, but… We just won’t start that conversation right now.
Anyway, you play Reasons for me, I’ll sing every word like I did ever since I was little. I’ll get damn-near teary-eyed listening to With You I’m Born Again. I’ll listen to Keith Sweat
even though I think he’s a bitch. But I’m not going to act like I don’t like the newer version of Make It Last Forever, and I’m not going to act like Jill Scott’s Love Rain (Head Nod Mix) with Mos Def isn’t one of my favorite love songs EVER. PERIOD. Just LISTEN to the lyrics. (Link: Educate Yourself)Anyway… This isn’t what we should be complaining about.
What we SHOULD be complaining about is
Beyonce getting an R&B artist award on BET even though she hasn’t made any R&B in yearsthe fact that you either have to either be seen as an artsy a-hole to listen to the good stuff, or that a crappy Franchize Boyz songs can beat out a quality Donnell Jones song in a battle of the beats on the radio (this ish actually happened… I almost spit out my sexy-tasting Chipotle. Almost).And that Panama must hate poetry or need to listen to some good neo-soul ish if he thinks it’s “pseudo-deep.” *cough*Whyyyyyy, ohhhh, whyyy did she have to leave and go awaaaaayyyy?
@Purplenat,
EDIT: Whoops, messed up the coding. >_>
@Purplenat, I shouldn’t generalize when I’m running my mouth…bad habit, sorry to hit any under 30s when I was swinging (including my 19 year old niece who was raised on the good stuff from back in the day)
@Purplenat, i love poetry. hell, i used to be a performing poet. lol.
as far as pseudo-deepness, i extrapolated but really i’m talking about india.arie’s second cd which was like the most pretentious retardation ever (save “the truth” i love that song). and let’s be real here though…a lot of sh*t is only considered ne0-soul b/c it aint pop and it ain’t all that deep but b/c of its labeling, people transfix these deeper meanings to sh*t like “little red boat”
you know who i miss?
adriana evans and the brand new heavies.
@Panama Jackson, THAT’S IT! ADRIANA EVANS! that’s the artist I couldn’t remember in my earlier comment. D@mn, you’re on a roll Peej! I loved that album. Now if I could just find the person who stole it on my 11 hour Greyhound trip to Detroit. long story. long, long, story.
@Miss Patterson,
Co-signage on the Adriana Evans..that joint was solid all the way through. My pops actually stole mine.
@Panama Jackson,
That’s funny. I never even considered India.Arie neo-soul. More like… reg’lah old informed/pseudo-feminist R&B.
I’m thinking more… Floetry, Jill Scott (when she feels like it), Dwele (when HE feels like it)… Amel Larrieux (some of her newer stuff is real nice). Then there’s always the more electronica-type neo-soul, if you’re really open-minded (like Kendra Foster, goes by Kendra, was involved w/ P-Funk, album is called, like… myriadmorphonicalotofotherstuffIdon’tfeelliketyping). And then, if you want some good/unpretentious guitar-lined music, go with Anthony David. I think I only thought of him because he has a song with India.Arie (which I love deeply), but whatever. He’s quite good. Other people have already named a lot and I can’t think too straight right now anyway; I just had surgery on my teeth and I’m puffy. I’ma go lay down.
People aren’t in love like they used to be.. and you can’t sing about what you don’t know/feel.
The music is a reflection of today’s society’s culture/values.. and while I do not believe that EVERYONE has this way of thinking,
MOSTa LOT of people focus more on their ability to make love rather than their ability to love. SEX [not love] is the focus of the popular “r&b” songs [i.e. tracks by Trey Songz, The Dream, Jeremih, etc] and they’re popular because they chose to talk about what society wants to hear about.@Tyrone, The Merchants Of Cool play to the younger, more manipulative crowd because they know the older you get, the more you’re going to question ish. I am a believer in Black Love (c)
@Tyrone,
I see what you’re saying, but there are a multitude of songs from back in the day that are equally as sexual in nature as compared to songs of today. Older songwriters were basically liars (I’m not gonna say they were smoother) and they fabricated the freak nasty stuff and finessed it a bit as oppose to being so open and in-yo’-face with it. But they were still talkin’ ’bout f*ckin’ regardless.
Even tales of infidelity, baby mama/daddy drama, being boufriend number, and trickin’ existed and predates the stuff out now.
@Monk,
True..but give me the ‘mystery’, if you will, of the way they said it over ‘b**** you stole my money and ufcked my man now imma kick you a**’ any day! lol
ala Woman to Woman
I have a theory on the downfall of R&B starting with Boyz II Men End of the Road. Its really that record’s fault.
Every now and then you get a quality R&B song (doesn’t even have to be a love song) and people go crazy over it from Maxwell or Robin Thicke but by and large its a shame what happened to mainstream R&B.
@Dorian G., care to share your actual theory??
@Panama Jackson,
We all know the music is largely a copy cat industry. Look at these lyrics from End of the Road, arguably the most successful R&B song, of the most successful R&B group of the decade.
—————————————————–
Girl Im here for you
All those times of night when you just hurt me
And just run out with that other fella
Baby I knew about it, I just didnt care
You just dont understand how much I love you do you?
Im here for you
Im not out to go out and cheat on you all night
Just like you did baby but thats all right
Hey, I love you anyway
And Im still gonna be here for you till my dying day baby
Right now, Im just in so much pain baby
Coz you just wont come back to me
Will you? just come back to me
—————————————————–
Now under what circumstances should a grown self respecting man ever utter those words? This song was as big a smash as one could possibly imagine and bam, you now have your formula for R&B for the rest of the decade. Every new act that came out came in the mold of this, dudes whining and begging, trying to out-simp each other, stop singing about love and started out-simping each other about chex. The next step was to start out-simping each other about who has the most chex. Fast forward 17 years later, and the biggest r&b song of the year is titled “Birfday Chex”. Just my thoughts
I love this post. I love hip hop. I truly do. It’s the music of my youth but I LOOOOVE R&B and soul music. And you are sooo right. Quality R&B just isn’t being made I don’t think. I blame the recording industry. You have to search really really hard to find a good R&B record anymore… If you don’t want to listen to the oldies. But, they are still out there… popping up every now and then. Like Eric Benet’s Love and Life is a good one. And I love Avant’s latest album, “Avant” came out in 2008 I think. I LOVE it! Musiq’s On My Radio I think is a good effort. And Maxwell, of course.
@pgh muse, you know, this maybe neo-soul blasphemy…
but save for a few songs on each album, i think musiq’s only good album was soulstar. that joint was good nearly all the way thru. every other album had some dope cuts, “halfcrazy” “mary go round” “beautiful” etc, but largely, those albums sucked.
@pgh muse,
I have to add Eric Roberson to your good list of male R&B crooners….
This post is nostalgic as hell. R. Kelly was rapping as far back as 12Play.
Jodeci/Bobby Brown etc. are far more ghetto than The-Dream whose albums are dope.
The new Trey Songz album is 90% baby making music and only features 2 raps on the whole disk.
Maxwell’s dropped 2/3 superb albums this decade.
And all the rnbsangers these days have atleast a couple “real” RnB gems on each album. e.g. Take You Down by Ike..I mean Chris Breezy.
But yeah if anyone should be for this rap/sanging thing it’s probably R. Kelly because he’s made the stuff sound so good in the past.
@Dangerous,
“Jodeci/Bobby Brown etc. are far more ghetto than The-Dream whose albums are dope.” scratching head Uhm, Seriously? How old are you? Cuz I think that’s gotta be a factor if you’re seriously serious about this statement. Oh and whether or not yousa Grady Baby…
@bittersweet’s baby, loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool 19.
Alotta old heads in here crying about everything musical post September 11th 2001. Gotta stick up for my generation knahmean?
/puts on that Ron Browz.
@bittersweet’s baby,
But he’s not wrong tho. They even made a ridiculous parody movie CB4 based on the fake thuggishness of Jodeci
@Dorian G., i think its half right. i think they were more ghetto in their actual lives but they didn’t necessarily bring it into their music.
and who told you cb4 was based on jodeci??!? that doesnt even make sense.
@Panama Jackson,
I thought they based it on NWA until I saw something on VH1 and they were talking about most awesome movies of something, and they mentioned it was largely based on an r&b group Jodeci.
@Panama Jackson, I think The-Dream has an identity crisis. He always looks uncomfortable in his clothes & shit. He’s obviously really influenced by Jodeci, R. Kelly & them and it looks like he decided to the ’09 version of them.
But maybe it’s just because The-Dream is one wierd looking man.
When did you fall in love with
hiphop, er, um R&B? Maybe a better question is – Who killed R&B? You say JimJ (who has this Pigpen from The Peanuts Gang dusty thing going on somehow) and Are-Uh.I say PuffDaddy, Puff, PDiddy, Diddy, SeanJohn, Sean Combs, Sean, Justin’s Daddy, Kim BabyDaddy, SarahChapman’s Baby Daddy or whatever you want to call him.
And it wasn’t an outright stabbing in the courtyard with a dead waiter, dog barking, bloody glove kinda murder. It was a put anti-freeze in his Kool-aid kinda poisoning.
When did he start Prestoning R&B which lead to it’s ultimate demise?
When he took Cheryl Lynn’s Got To Be Real and turned it into Father MC’s I’ll Do For You.
That was 1990.
@SexyCool, speak the damn truth!!!! this was my first thought when I started reading this. Bump Jim Jones, I can agree with R Kelly ….Futha Muckin Puffy Daddy is the culprit!!! Can somebody do somethin about mtv allowin him to kill real music and discouraging real musicians on tv?
@Nut,
Remember when MTV showed videos? What dahell happened to music videos? The only time I see a video is on somebody’s FaceBook page or YouTube.
Do people my age watch videos? Or should I be ‘off that’? ~lol~
@SexyCool, i might agree with you except acts like mint condition and silkk came out in the early 90s and were selling big units.
what you’re really saying is that puffy was just ahead of his time. lol.
and puffy was doing the hip-hop r&b thing (mary’s first album) but there were still the babyfaces out there. now, everybodys’ making the same songs over and over (mainstream that is).
@Panama Jackson,
I LOVES me some Mint Condition!!! Them negroes can’t get anything I got! I will send my momma over to ‘they’ house twice a week to cook and clean. I have their album “The Collection (1991 – 1998)” in my 1994 Kenwood Rack System CD changer RIGHT NOW!!!
AND……If “Lil G” from Silk will come personally serenade me, he could hit. Even if he is a midget. Teasing.
@SexyCool,
“I say PuffDaddy, Puff, PDiddy, Diddy, SeanJohn, Sean Combs, Sean, Justin’s Daddy, Kim BabyDaddy, SarahChapman’s Baby Daddy or whatever you want to call him.”
I think he’s gonna kill it even deader with that Last Train to Hot Mess album.
@Cheekie, Can’t lie. I Love Puff Daddy NO HOMO.
I look back on the BadBoy Era like “yeah them dudes was cool as hell.”
Puff signed and executively produced your favourite Mary album.
He developed Jodeci.
That first Faith album was heavy.
112
GIVE THAT MAN HIS PROPS!!!!
TAKE THAT, TAKE THAT
@Dangerous,
Yeah, I give Sean Combs all kinds of props. He’sa fantastic producer. Puff Daddy, too.
It’s that Diddy that makes me feel some kinda way…
@Dangerous/Cheekie,
I am prepared to give Sean “Puff Daddy” Combs just a ‘bit’ of love for the aforementioned acts.
Just a ‘bit’.
When you find out who killed it…come get me. I have a few words to say to these folks!
How about my ‘black’ R&B selection stops with LP’s…yup that’s right..remember those big black shiny circular things…? yeah those. The cd’s I do have are recordings/remakes of those. R&B Lover from birth, that’s all my parents played.
How about I was the only 10 yr old I knew who was mad at Sybil remaking “Don’t make me over” while folk were jamming to it, lol…yeah my love for love songs/R&B is THAT serious.
Hardly anyone plays an instrument anymore and ERRYBODY got to have a microphone..da hell?
Let me get down with some Switch or play Homely Girl..whatchall know bout that!
*sigh*
“Pretty much, Ne-yo and Plies are the only people putting out that real R&B.”
Yep…as I sing big face hunnids…lol
Solid R&B is still out there, you just have dig for it…hard. It’s definitely not being played on the radio. As of late though I’ve noticed that all the R&B I’ve been listening to has been from the 70′s/80′s. I’ve been on a serious David Porter thing the last few days…
You asked
“And why do you think the music has taken such a turn from the soul music of yesteryear?”
Them folks ain’t making money of it, period. Might as well crank out mindless drivel that we keep folks rich
and keeps me dancing.LOL!!! I see a lot of folks are feeling Trey Songz, but I don’t know I can’t get with that kat.PJack are you not feeling Raheem DeVaughn new mixtape, Ledisi’s new one, Maxwell’s new one?
@miss t-lee, i like maxwell’s new joint. not a big fan of raheem devaughn or ledisi really. i tried though. i listen to all of that thoroughly over and over before i determine that i just can’t.
@Panama Jackson,
I gotcha.
I think there are some good songs/albums out recently . . .
I was feeling Kem’s two albums and those came out in the new millenium.
Musiq Soulchild has had some real good love songs . . . especially that ifuleave and sobeautiful if we are talking real recent . . .
Lyfe Jennings first album . . . ghetto maybe, but at least it was honest .. . or sounded honest anyway who knows . . and I could listen to that entire album without skipping. . . well maybe skipping one or two towards the end.
Corinne Bailey Rae (had that like a star on repeat . . .surprised as hell when she performed it on one of those award shows wit John Mayer and John Legend) . . . Joss Stone . . . There are quite a few . . . I still like mostly old school stuff. . . but I think thats just me getting old with the big 3-0 just 3 years away . . .
@IVR,
“Lyfe Jennings first album . . . ghetto maybe, but at least it was honest”
I just couldn’t get with him talking…after.every.single.song. it was a bit much for me.
@Smiley Face, “I just couldn’t get with him talking…after.every.single.song. it was a bit much for me.”
I thought it was creative . . . the album and all the songs leading into each other . . story of his life type deal. Maybe a bit overdone.
@IVR,
I liked the songs..just had to fast forward through the talking, lol
@IVR,
Kem kinda grew on me. I used to cringe at his voice, though. lol
I LOVE Corinne Bailey Rae’s acoustic version of “Girl Put Your Records On”.
English white women stole R&B! Duffy, Winehouse, Joss Stone… say what you will, but they have more Rhythm and Blues than Drake.
It’s a sad day in Obama’s America.
@ForNot, English white women stole R&B!
This is an un-truth. They are aiight… but there are still artists putting out better R&B… although Amy Crackhouse’s album was the biznass…
@ForNot,
I can’t really get with Joss Stone. She has that “trying too hard to be soulful” twang in her voice.
I loves me Winehouse, though!
@Cheekie,
“I can’t really get with Joss Stone. She has that “trying too hard to be soulful” twang in her voice.”
I thought I was the only one who thought that…lol
@miss t-lee,
How did I KNOW you would agree here?? I just had this strange feeling you would. lol
It’s probably because you’re good peoples.
As for Joss Stone, her voice is nice, but I can tell she’s straining to get that “Black” sound. Of course she says her inspirations are a lot of Black divas, so it’s like she was in her bedroom as a kid practicing the diva grunt or something.
@Cheekie,
Especially on the remake of “Love” that she did.
It was like nails on a chalkboard.
@Cheekie,
I forgot to add she’s no Dusty Springfield…lol
@miss t-lee,
again..we *here*
@ForNot,
Yeah Corine Bailey Rae was hot b4 she lost her hubby ah well
I’ve been saying this for years. Everybody talkin’ ’bout Hip Hop being dead when Rhythm and Blues was in the casket long before.
Here’s a few of the causes of death:
*Women not being able to get along. Back in the day, I used to go to sleep listnening to the soothing sounds of EnVogue, Zhane’, SWV, even Brownstone and the likes. With time, these groups fell apart due to cattiness and disputes. The death of the girl group is a major factor in R&B’s decline. There aren’t really any out right now.
*Crack. Although music and lots of art has been the result of many artists experimenting or using drugs, when crack hit the scene, shyt drastically changed. Some (if not most) of the most celebrated musicians throughout history used some type of drug, but crack had a tremendously different effect. Whitney and Bobby were once the baddest cats out until they got hooked on it. Same goes for DeVante’s production and JoDeCi. Instead of inspiring, that drug took people totally off of their game like nothing else.
*Collaborations. I think Usher is a very viable R&B talent, but to hear Young Jeezy on one of his songs just kills me. I like both artists, just not together. Every so-called R&B song has F-A-B-O-L-O-U-S or Lil’ Wayne spittin’ bars and every so-called hip hop song has Ne-Yo or The Dream on the hook. This must cease in order to revive both genres. One of my favorite joints right now is Mario’s “Break Up” and there is really no good reason why Gucci Mane is in that song. None.
@Monk,
“The death of the girl group is a major factor in R&B’s decline. There aren’t really any out right now.”
You don’t count Sophia Fresh and Electrik Red?!
*sniggling with full sarcasm*
That Mario track is nice.
@miss t-lee,
Those groups are right up there with OMG – Tiny’s daughter’s group.
@Monk,
CTFU!!!
@Monk,
you are right about the collabos. the genres are starting to fuse together, and it hasn’t been good for them. then, throw in the gospel artists who are singing R&B love songs to JC and using autotune, and what we have is a mess on our hands. kanye is singing, Mary Mary is rapping, and R&B as we knew it is dead. SMH.
@deN.I.A.l is not a river in Egypt…., starting to? They fused together back in ’95. Resistance just lessened every passing year until they competed for the exact same audience as of 2002.
@Monk, i do believe i agree with everything you said.
you know, Usher didn’t want Jeezy on that “love in this club” track but Polow put him on it anyway and hten leaked the track. i suppose it worked out but i’m with ursh on that one.
@Monk,
This is a great list. Very valid. Especially the collabos. Why can’t there be a TRUE R&B song. Why we gotta get our fix by listening to Lil’ Wayne “sing” like he’s strainin’ on the toilet?
@Cheekie, LMAO! I actually like Lil Wayne’s singing too.
@Monk,
Aside from ruining some dope artists, crack also helped in the destruction of R&B (and Hip Hop for that matter) because of the whole crack baby syndrome. A lot of acts that are out right now, were born in the late ’80′s – early ’90′s when crack was at an all-time high (no pun). There’s a good possibility that some of these teenagers and cats in their early 20′s were crack babies. At least from some of the dances they do, that’s what it seems like.
@Monk, “Aside from ruining some dope artists, crack also helped in the destruction of R&B (and Hip Hop for that matter) because of the whole crack baby syndrome. A lot of acts that are out right now, were born in the late ’80’s – early ’90’s when crack was at an all-time high (no pun). There’s a good possibility that some of these teenagers and cats in their early 20’s were crack babies. At least from some of the dances they do, that’s what it seems like.”
LMBAO at this breakdown. Too funny.
@Monk,
I blame Mr. Knowles for number one. Destiny’s Child was a bastard named Beyoncenay. Everytime someone decided to out shine his beloved jewel cuts were made just bad. Made singing lil girls everywhere shudder @ what their other potential group members daddy would do to them espcially if they got down w/ the EtOH. smh
Hmm….
I think part of this is generational. I’m sure the generation before us said the same thing about the R&b we cherish. Having said that, I do believe the quality has taken a steep decline. R&b is not having some rapper drop 16 on it or singing the hook on some rapper’s track. Uh….Come back when somethin dope hits you. (8 Mile)
I thought something was wrong with me because alot of my music seems to stop around the end of the 1990s, hip hop and R&b. I do have some underground of both that continues to the present day, but the joints that are readily recognizable to anyone whom turns on my mp3 player are from the 1990s.
I have to agree with the commentor who said that they sing about what they experience. So we can blame ourselves (society) for making it ok to NOT go through the work, pleasure, and pain of a relationship but instead get the goodies and keep it moving.
Only when your SO has made you crazy can you sing about it. Then once ya’ll make up, you guessed the joys of being bunned up is a track waiting to happen.
@Stank-0, “Only when your SO has made you crazy can you sing about it. Then once ya’ll make up, you guessed the joys of being bunned up is a track waiting to happen.”
..”break up to make up, that’s all we do…first you love me then you hate me that’s a game for fools..”
“whhhyyy (somebody), why do people break up (oouunhh) turn around and make up…I just can’t ssseeeeeee..”
don’t get me started!! LOL
It’s funny this is the topic today. Just last night, I listened to my old D’Angelo, and lamented his absence. Good R&B is out there, PJ. It’s not being played on the radio. You have to work hard to get your hands on it, but thank BBJ for the internet.
And don’t hate on neo-soul. there are some great neo-soul artists making some great love songs and baby-making songs.
today, R&B is dead b/c people aren’t making music for adults anymore. old school R&B was music for grown ass men and women. while today, the R&B music is made for teenagers and the club. and i think perhaps the old school artists had experiences with love and pain and heartache, that went far beyond chex, to draw from when they were in the studio.
@deN.I.A.l is not a river in Egypt…., oh i know its out there. lol. but if i don’t pretend it’s not, then what would this post have been about?
lol.
@Panama Jackson,
lol…there are a whole world of things you could post about…like how you being a 3 and CB’s blue bowtie/sweater combo is a part of the biggest government cover-up since the Iraq war.
@deN.I.A.l is not a river in Egypt….,
iQuit you.
@deN.I.A.l is not a river in Egypt…., you know….i wasnt even going to post today but chris brown has just opened up the ugliest parts of his wardrobe for this apology tour. i think he believes the ugly clothes will get him some more sympathy.
and ummmm im not trying to disrespect my elders or no sh*t, but stop playing my generation. My parents are older and missed out on the entirety of late 80′s and 90′s era R&B music. im 22, and yet my FAVORITE r&b group is Silk. (im not taking anything away from Mint, Shai, New Edition or anyone else, i just prefer them) good music is good music and people like myself who arent satisfied with this hot pile of (put whatever word you want here) thats out now will go find it.
I totally agree, unfortunately talent is not a requirement these days to be a successful recording artist. And by success I mean the radio and the club plays your song over and over and over and over until you unknowingly know all the word to a song you hate…sigh
Thank god for neo-soul!! I just saw Maxwell in concert last night and I swear my pannies turned to dust… POOF! If my pannies hadn’t melted I would’ve thrown then on stage. There is plenty of great love making/baby making/turn pannies (yes pannies) into lead songs out there.
@ deN.I.A.l is not a river in Egypt…. Unfortunately music is NOT made for grown ups. I blame the Disney channel *waving fist* for giving tweens the power to control entire industries oh and t-pain, damn you autotune! Making real MUSIC is a dying art; you know where there are real instruments in the background. Anywho, I could rant about this all day…don’t give up Panama!! Throw some Van Hunt, Maxwell, Jill Scott (I recommend crown royal), and *insert other neo-soul cats* in there, all hope is not lost…yet.
Your observation is well taken, and that is exactly why I keep Anthony Hamilton on repeat.. “The Point of It All.. I love yo” the best song I have heard in months!
@BabyI’mAStar,
SAY THAT!!
I’m listening to that right now.
As a music lover I feel your pain and noticed this a long minute ago…..MY all time favorite male recording artist is none other than the late great Mr. Marvin Gaye.
Aw.
@Cheekie, shuga nononooooooooooooo
@Panama Jackson, LOL
My 2 pennies
I’m not surprised that RnB is where it is because we are in a society that is what it is, life is F’d up and its hard to sang lies to people when you are feeling something completely different. many of the sangers that we loved and cherished were not keeping it “real” their music wasnt matching their actions and in this age of technology it is too easy to know when there is a disconnect. Examples you ask?…..Luther, Freddy Jackson, Maxwell(?), Prince(?), Atlantic Starr, Ready for the World….etc… were singing some of the greatest songs ever in heterosexual coupledom but most of these men weren”t sangin to actual women in there personal lives….as an audience we didnt care because the songs were excellent and appealed to anyone. Hwever, a lot of these singers could not be real with who they were really diggin but they didnt have a media following them every five seconds so they could at least hide in the shadows in their down time. Nowadays it is prolly very stressful trying to having your outward life match your public persona (ask Queen Latifah)
From Whitney to Bobby to 80% of the temptations, Rick James, MJ, Harold Melvin and the Blue Notes, all struggle heavily with drug abuse..back in the day you could hide out and ppl wouldnt worry about your short hiatus, NOW you better be pumpin them hits out or we are left to assume you got the monster or the crack pipe (ask D’angelo).
Finally, many of the singers, though they were singin great love songs were living very different love lives….Brian McKnight, Al B Sure, Christopher Williams, Ike Turner , some of the OJays etc.. all were guilty of domestic abuse. I think its hard to continue to drop songs in this current news cycle when you are commiting violent crimes against your SO (ask Chris Brown)
@Blacklaw, I think of true artists as vessels, and its funny how the most beautiful work often comes from the most flawed individuals…closeted gay men are probably thinking of their male lovers when making love songs, its still a love song tho no?!? Affecting the listener and their own experiences with love if they can relate…….art is a great connector. I memba I felt SO connected thru hip hop once upon a time LOL
@Blacklaw, with all due respect, I hate that “keep it real” logic applied today….
Because the slippery slope dictates that actors are acting lies on all those TV shows that get ratings and movies that do big box office numbers. But we know that notion there is just silly, because it’s built to be fiction that entertains. So why can’t we think the same way about music? Why can’t we simply figure that even though this person is married with children IRL, he’s telling the story or giving you a character portrayal of what a single person is going thru for that given song? Recording artists aren’t allowed creative license?
Not saying I don’t understand the 7:30 entertainment show world we live in…but the point remains.
True, people aren’t happy anymore, but I still say I sometimes wish Mary J had stayed on the drugs and sheet. her music was so much more enjoyable to me at that point…
But yes, it began dying in 1995, IMO, and by 1998, all black music was basically brain dead. You are correct to blame R. Kelly, but you cannot blame Jim Jones. he’s from Harlem. Harlem caused Jim Jones, not the other way around. but he’s still Jim Jones, so you CAN blame him for things like Skinny Jeans, Terrorism, and Hurricane Katrina.
Regardless, I can’t say everything is dead, but it’s kind of like Musical SkyNet became self aware and launched a counter-attack that eliminated it’s enemies in R&B, and all the rest of us are playing the role of John Connor fighting off the machine.
That was a good analogy, but it shows my inherent nerdiness that I can illustrate the plight of black folks’ grown arse music with that of the backstory from the Terminator Series. Tuh.
I’ll just say my radio for my whip uses a flash drive. I’ve got almost NO music past the 2000s, with the exception being a few guilty pleasures that I remember bagging fine chicks at a club whilst they were playing.
I’mma stop now, because I don’t wanna type anymore.
@Dante_Alexander, “I’mma stop now, because I don’t wanna type anymore”
bwahahahahaha!
Jazmine Sullivan’s album was good too. Bustin’ out windows and everything. That was a banger.
*sigh*
This depressed the h3ll out of me. Cuz its true.
Carry on.
@blackberry molasses,
I know. I gotta pop in some Maxwell today just because of this post.
@blackberry molasses,
Chin up grasshopper! Chin up!
I lament Old School R&B, which is why my LPs (records, vinyl, wax) collection is still deep and shelved. I listen to the stuff my father listened to where people actually played instruments, told stories and could sing. Scuse my french, but F*ck Modern R&B. I’ve never seen such a misrepresentation of soul in my life.
@CPT Callamity,
You got some Phoebe Snow I can borrow?
@Smiley Face,
Haven’t heard that name in ages. Prolly not on wax.
Panama, you read my mind! I was just asking a friend who else in the span of 15 years has put out quality music that can be played 20, 30 years from now. I go to Essence Music Festivial every year and see ole Frankie stand up there with his all-white and sing the SAME songs and it only gets better!
Folks aren’t happy anymore or better yet, we, the listeners have convinced artists that killing, beating hoes, hating our baby mamas/daddies is ALL we want to hear. Some would even blame the crack era. I’m all for getting your pain and frustrations with your situation out on a record. Hell, Mary J. built her career on that, but at some point, we have to talk about love. If you turn the radio on right now, what will you hear? A song about a dumb ass dance my nephew could have made up and stuntin.
It’s just so much more to life. If I want to hear GOOD music, I have to turn it on what I used to call “the old folks station” or listen to my own Babyface, BIIM CDs or watch BetJ. NONE of those songs are being played on mainstream radio.
For shame!
@Southern Lady,
Actually…most of us listeners have told the artist what they want, but remember…the industry shifted to accommodate an attitude driven market. Artists are packaged now and the target demo is younger than it ever has been. The crack era was hardly the demise of it, as during that time we were given New Jack Swing, the guy/girl groups like EnVogue, Jodeci, etc. The artists aren’t even listening to us…they are caught up in their self-delusional world that white kids idolize, but even they are hip to the game now. I used to f*ck with NWA, but they gave birth to any greasy faced bastard that felt he had a “street story” to tell.
since i actually have to work today…i just wanted to drop off my two cents and bounce….
the closest thing to any of the stuff you named, without venturing into neosoul is probably trey songz’s FIRST album. it had some r&b on it. and besides that…maybe j. holiday counts? me dunno.
sad that i could only come up with 2 names.
ok im gone again….mas’sa comin…
get up on some mayer hawthorne.
that’s all for now. thank you, and goodnight
@A Plus,
good look, I just heard “maybe so, maybe no.”
*thumbs up*
I want that grimey 90′s hip hop back, the wire and the sopranos back on tv …. I even want my baby back ribs (no swine) …..
But like them youngins tell me, them days are over …. so get over it
I’m sorry Mr Jackson …. I am foreal
@Eff yo couch,
I sweah fohgot you is the kang of fooliwang.
I blame TuPac *I know you readin this you smacklively ssa ni&&a* D-angelo, Tank, & Jaihim. Last I heard they had taken R&B out behind the wood shed and… HORRIBLE horrible what they did to him. And phrases like, “money or women if you chasing one the other’s gettin away.” I also blame sorry ssa women. Who’s gonna sing for them and their love not even they sorry ssa children… DO BETTER!
@WuDaMan, Excuse me while I try to get my sidewalk sociology on. Lemme see here. If I recal the time Arruh in Bea died was about the time of the fatherless children’s all my children having chillren. got to have something to do with it. Dudes probably found out genetles is like magnets, they just want to come together.
So nobody’s feeling Eric Roberson. & I know John Legend is like clowns and okera you either like him or hate him. And Anthony Hamilton, + that new maxwell done hit. No Robin Thick in yall rotation. Who is gonna be performing for free this saturday yippie in the great state of Illadelph.
@WuDaMan,
i love Eric Roberson! In fact, I listen to all of the men you’ve mentioned.
i don’t know much about r&b but i really like ryan leslie … he sounds nothing like today’s pop r&b … without being retro/nostalgic.
@C.R.,
The album was good. He was slept on, hard. Like 24k in the first week slept on. Either that or it was hella bootlegged.
I bought mine though.
@miss t-lee,
mmhmm it was rather decent. i like gibberish, just because its like a encylopedia brown mystery tryin to figure out what hes saying.
@Chasdizz,
LOL!!! You’re right. You almost think you hear a real word and then you’re like…no.
I agree 100 % ! I miss the music from the 90′s and I’m only 20 lol. I rarely listen to the radio and I’m constantly stealing my mom’s cd’s! I just can’t listen to this crap they put out now… nor will I EVER PAY for it. I weep for my children God knows what will be out for them to listen to. I was tutoring this young lady in the 8th grade not too long ago and she asked if she could listen to some music while she worked… no problem whatever makes you concentrate. right? WRONG she goes to imeem and types in Plies- Bust it baby.
I wanted to cry lol… really, bust it baby puts you in that studying mode. This is what you consider quality music?? I just couldn’t that day… my heart sank! That was her and her classmates idea of a love song. I would one of my favorite groups is Con funk shun they’re a classic in my house! Can’t go wrong with straight from the heart (mom kept this on repeat alllll the time lol) Now thats music.
The chief killers of R&B as we know it go as follows:
Everyone is angry about Hip-Hop sampling R&B songs, but as Stetsasonic said, if they did not, people could have forgot (and generally did)…and at least a good majority of Hip-Hop’s sampling practitioners had clever arrangements. Why is it R&B then started sampling Hip-Hop beats whole hog (in most cases a sample of a sample, basically playing the 12″s instrumental), throwing a couple of pretty keys over it, then having some random female sing over it and call it a day?
They ditch the soul and the funk they could pull out of mostly-organic instruments and got too reliant on the all purpose keyboard (possessed most often by ppl who couldn’t play in a funky or soulful way). So cats who couldn’t play began emulating cats who couldn’t play.
R&B complained about Hip-Hop stealing its thunder and its money, but then they turn right around and emulate the worst aspects of it. The ghettoness, the vulgarity, and worst of all, being all extra blunt. The song that talked about “making my nature rise” in ’87 became the song that talked about “getting my d*ck hard” in ’07. The euphemism is dead in music at a time when ironically enough the juvenile sexual innuendo is out of control in popular language.
R&B also lost (or ceded) two other things to Hip-Hop:
-social commentaries and calls to action. Marvin Gaye’s What’s Goin’ On was an album for the ages. MJ would try to keep that alive with songs like “Man In The Mirror” and “Heal The World” at a time when the rest of R&B wasn’t interested. R&B didn’t wanna get out of the bedroom for two seconds to observe the rest of the world. The game became love love love and Hip-Hop saw the opening and went for it.
-GUYS! How many of you know a billion chicks who claim they can sing yet not a single dude who can for real? Dudes are barely even writing the stuff. R&B stopped including the guys in the conversation a long time ago (probably in the middle of new jack swing’s time). It’s been all for, by, and about females for as long as a good amount of people who read this blog can remember. The guys ran to Hip-Hop in droves and as such a generation of cats who probably could have done R&B some good focused on Hip-Hop. Not saying they would been good, but R&B could have used that focus that improved the breed (e.g. competition that says they can do it better)
Not sure if anyone brought up Anthony Hamilton (sorry I didn’t read through everything). He’s the only thing close to old school soul. He sings about love, heartache, and takes you to church every now and again. Unfortunately he’s the only one I can add to the list past 1996.
@Jill,
cosign completely.
You ain’t neva lied.